TOPIC: Organizing True Dungeon Tokens

cdsmith wrote: I finally decided to do something about the organization of my true dungeon tokens. What I found was a nice coin folder that fit the tokens perfectly. I got a hold of a Dansco 40mm Silver Rounds album (about $18) and it looks like it is going to work out perfectly. Each page will hold 9 tokens and there are 5 pages per album for a total of 45 tokens. Since the tokens are a bit thicker than a silver round I took out one of the pages. The removed page can be easily reinserted if needed.

Each page has slide out protective plastic covers that slip UNDER the face and back of the pages but OVER the tokens. You can't really see them in the photo but each token is protected front and back. This way even though the tokens fit tightly onto the openings, they are also held in place by the plastic. The book works great at holding those tokens that are not going to change during a run. The two bags are for weapons and potions/scrolls. Things that need to be slide and things that need to be turned in during a run are not put into the book.

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We have been using these for a couple of years. I went with the 41mm holes so that you can take them (potions, scrolls) out easier in the heat of battle.

I am working on a sash with very strong magnets sewn into it. I will get pictures up when I am done with it.

A fishing vest might work for most people, as it has quite a few pockets all over the front of it.

Mike Steele wrote: The last two years I've come with the party cards for all our runs already filled out, and the Coaches really appreciated that. I think it was rare though, at least one of my coaches said that was the only filled-out party card he'd seen. It really came in handy two years ago, when I was running really late and Raven was our Coach, and I had the Party Card filled out and ready to go

I agree: I've seen very few pre-filled party cards on my shifts. But on those occasions where someone had gone through the trouble to prepare one... Oh my goodness it was nice. (Especially since the folks who used the character builder tended to be the ones who had 102 tokens which needed calculating)

Some folks even used the party card tool to create a "party" of all their own character builds. Then they could select the single line ("Ranger build for Smoak", "Rogue build for SeaLich", "5th lvl Barbarian") to copy over onto their current run's Party Card.

Sometimes I double checked the stats (especially when they looked wrong, or when the Orb of Might was in play) but for the most part, it was a huge time saver. Being able to glance at a line of numbers, say "Let me see your HoP and Might tokens" and then transfer the line to the new card, was fantastic.

Thank you to the fine folks who put the Character builder together, AND the players who took the time to actually use it!

I had somewhat of a different experience this year. My first run, I had the party's card pre-printed with the new character generator and even arrived early (before the ticket time which included 24 minutes of coaching time this year). Perhaps the pre generated card lulled the coaches into a false sense of security or something because by the time the coach had gone around and verified all of the token load outs (one page printout vs one binder page per class) we had not only missed our training room time, we were ushered into the dungeon at nearly the halfway mark. It was a little disheartening to realize that all that painstaking preparation seemed to do absolutely nothing.

Ironically, the rest of my runs I simply brought a full binder page per class and spread them out on the table. I then went around the table with the coach and helped manually calculate the party card. Each time, we finished with time to spare.

Please understand that coaches are supposed to personally verify all the tokens which affect the stats on the sheet. Even if you come fully prepared with a party card completely filled out, it's our job as a coach to confirm its veracity. The easiest way to do that is if in addition to the party card, the player has also printed out the token mat and laid down all the required tokens in the appropriate circles on the mat. If the whole group follows that protocol, I can have the party card completed in no time flat.

I think some players mistakenly think bringing in a pre-printed party card is sufficient. I've had many players come to my table with their character sheet nicely printed out, but all their tokens were either bagged or stuck in binders. Many of these players got annoyed with me when I asked them to show me their tokens. Sorry, but that's my job. It's nothing personal. Even though you have an honest face, I still need to check.

Over the years I've seen some wonderfully creative ways to organize tokens. By all means, use whatever works best for you in the dungeon. But if you want to make your coach's life easier and get your party card filled ASAP, please have all your relevant tokens flat on the table, face up, oriented for readability. Having to flip back & forth between binder pages or sift through piles of tokens is not the most efficient use of a coach's time.

Sorry for being ranty.

P.S. This is not directed at any specific person—it's just a general suggestion.

Druegar wrote: Please understand that coaches are supposed to personally verify all the tokens which affect the stats on the sheet. Even if you come fully prepared with a party card completely filled out, it's our job as a coach to confirm its veracity.

Indeed. What Druegar says is true.

I have come to the realization, however, that what is asked of the coaches is - in many cases - a physically impossibility. When 10 players come up with a pre-made Party Card, plus binders full of tokens, and I need to physically see each token (and remember who is playing which character, and what the various set bonuses are) and write everything down, and answer questions, and collect runestones, and find missing lights/paperclips/etc... all in 24 mins or less... and do it with a smile! ... its just not going to happen.

So I insist on seeing everyone's Horn of Plenty/Amulet of Wonder/Ring o Riches, and their Charms of Awareness, and their Might gear... and after that, I just skim the stat lines to make sure it "looks right". After playing with the Character generator enough, and seeing so many maxed-out builds, I've got a good feel for when something looks wrong. But mostly, I figure that if a player has just shown they've got at least $2000 worth of tokens in their kit, odds are good they've got the rest of what they claim to have.

Plus - aside from the HoP and RoR which directly affect the number of treasure tokens TD gives out - any cheating the player does only hurts their own experience. If they are going to lie and say they've got a 25 AC when they've only got tokens for a 22 AC, then they are also the sort who will cheat by moving their HP counter 1 pt of damage when they just took 10 pts of damage. At some point, you've got to take it on their honor.

I'd rather encourage the use of the Party Card by giving players the benefit of the doubt and sending them on their adventure on time, than penalize the big spenders for bringing so many tokens on their run.

I hope that makes sense.

Raven, that makes sense, and I think players really appreciate the sense of trust that you extend to them in those circumstances. I know I did

And I agree with you, after you've developed enough characters and reviewed enough characters, you probably do get a pretty good sense when things look in line with what they should be.

We had a mixed experience this year with prefilling out the party card. One coach handed us the card ahead of time and said go ahead. We filled it all in laid out our binder he skimmed through it very quickly (though I do think he pretty much checked each token/stat) and we were done and ready. Another coach had a minor fit got out a clean card and began to try to do the card himself...the worst part was he was extremely slow and didn't start working on it until moments before the training was to begin. I spent the majority of that training time with a different coach in the training area finishing up the party card - the other coach was very friendly and knowledgable and all I had to do was flip through the binder for him (he also told the first coach that when a party has everything ready like we did sometimes you just need to take their word for it). Honestly I've played wizard enough that I didn't hurt from not seeing the plains, but we did have a few newer folks who probably would have benefited from having that coaches time during the training.

I'm guessing the guy we had problems with was having a bad day and/or was running way behind and we just caught the brunt of it; it certainly hasn't been our typical experience.

Jennifer