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TOPIC: The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026)

The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #37

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Phil Norton wrote: The C stands for Cauldron.

Before transmuted, there were combo tokens, with different amounts of cauldron's depicting rarity. 4 Cauldrons was equivalent to relic level rarity, and there have only 2 made, for the ending of 2 storylines. Nowadays I sometimes refer to them as Storyline relics, for those not familiar with the "4C" connotation.

Phil


Very cool! :)

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #38

Ian Lee wrote: Seems unlikely that any sort of usual recipe will deplete Fleece.

Every time some of us try to point out that Fleece should be increased in usual recipes, gets shot down. Arcanum stuff could have all taken 3x GF, for instance (also, 3x all TGs).

Then, the supply is just so much higher. It's not a spike. It's an ongoing problem that the amount of treasure going into circulation is vastly higher with VTD and increased player treasure pulls. While overcorrecting can lead to other problems, at least should try to have demand keep up with supply.

I saw some comments about 2022 stuff will just go to Maps. That will be insignificant. The supply of 2022 bits is vastly higher than the amount of Maps that will get made.

I don't remotely buy that somehow anyone missed out because they chose not to play VTD in 2020-2022 any more than anyone missed out in any year because they chose not to do something, but, ignoring that it feels like getting screwed with junk, what is the plan to have demand actually come anywhere close to supply?

Or, should MBs just be essentially as worthless as Planks? I don't see how 2023-2026 will be better unless something changes, like reducing drop rate on MBs to 10% or whatever as there's still far more treasure going out in comparison to earlier years when the balance would have been vastly different. Of course, we see what happens when things like that happen with 2019 MBs, where it's highly disruptive to expectations in a different way.


Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.
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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #39

Lequinian wrote:

Rob F wrote: Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.


truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=5&id=255516

:)


I think I've been consistent, I didn't want GF to increase in Arcanum / Storyline tokens, and I think the current glut will work itself out starting next year. I'm not sure TD needs to try to keep the value around $50 or so either, Aragonite dropped quite a bit, maybe it's OK if Fleece does also.

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #40

Mike Steele wrote:

Lequinian wrote:

Rob F wrote: Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.


truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=5&id=255516

:)


I think I've been consistent, I didn't want GF to increase in Arcanum / Storyline tokens, and I think the current glut will work itself out starting next year. I'm not sure TD needs to try to keep the value around $50 or so either, Aragonite dropped quite a bit, maybe it's OK if Fleece does also.


I'm not sure higher level trade goods dropping is a good thing.

There has to be some perceived "value" in order to justify $88 per GenCon ticket.
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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #41

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Lequinian wrote:

Rob F wrote: Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.


truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=5&id=255516

:)


I think I've been consistent, I didn't want GF to increase in Arcanum / Storyline tokens, and I think the current glut will work itself out starting next year. I'm not sure TD needs to try to keep the value around $50 or so either, Aragonite dropped quite a bit, maybe it's OK if Fleece does also.


I'm not sure higher level trade goods dropping is a good thing.

There has to be some perceived "value" in order to justify $88 per GenCon ticket.


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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #42

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Lequinian wrote:

Rob F wrote: Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.


truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=5&id=255516

:)


I think I've been consistent, I didn't want GF to increase in Arcanum / Storyline tokens, and I think the current glut will work itself out starting next year. I'm not sure TD needs to try to keep the value around $50 or so either, Aragonite dropped quite a bit, maybe it's OK if Fleece does also.


I'm not sure higher level trade goods dropping is a good thing.

There has to be some perceived "value" in order to justify $88 per GenCon ticket.

Isn’t that value actually running the dungeon? Where the perceived value comes in is paying $88 for a second or third+ run.

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #43

I would be in favor of being able to transmute/swap a GF for a 10x MH or 10x DS or 10x AI.

Also, would be in favor of transmuting/swapping a GF for an amount of Gold--Such as 6 GF for a 25K Bar. It could also have a time limit on transmuting.

Just some thoughts.

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #44

Very cool discussion.

Thanks for the heads up on the next 4C - that is really cool.

I would definitely hope that my gallon ziploc baggie full of 2021-2022 monster bits would be able to find some use other than GR but if that is all they will be good for, so be it.

Glad to see this announced!
David

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 3 months 3 weeks ago #45

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The next "4C" Transmute (coming in 2026) 2 days 18 hours ago #46

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Lequinian wrote:

Rob F wrote: Yep, I remember some of the recipe discussions, and I remember advocating for more fleece. Now here we are. Folks complained about increasing Fleece requirements in the recipes, and now thier complaining about there being too much Fleece.


truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=5&id=255516

:)


I think I've been consistent, I didn't want GF to increase in Arcanum / Storyline tokens, and I think the current glut will work itself out starting next year. I'm not sure TD needs to try to keep the value around $50 or so either, Aragonite dropped quite a bit, maybe it's OK if Fleece does also.


I'm not sure higher level trade goods dropping is a good thing.

There has to be some perceived "value" in order to justify $88 per GenCon ticket.


Pretty sure market forces drive the pricing. The last few in person GenCon sold out every ticket. Resale value of trade goods likely never entered people’s minds.

Other cons don’t usually sell out. For those, I don’t suspect treasure value will change that too much (unless something got added as random treasure at X con that is highly sought after and only available there.)

Where the value of trade goods becomes a problem is with 8K orders. If they drop too low, combined with $80 PYP’s, it becomes much less expensive to buy via the secondary market. In time, fewer 8K orders/auctions would drive the costs of the trade goods back up.
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