TOPIC: FINAL Big Change to Powers Available on the Mark of Enlightenment

I think the mark was always going to lock you into 1 option out of the x that Jeff set up.

Impy wrote: You simply sound to be much more of a completionist/collector than I am. I look at this through the lens of game balance, in which a token that change between 8 different fairly powerful effect is much much much much more powerful than a token that can only do one of those effects. You say things I don't fully comprehend, like needing 8 different marks to "utilize the mark's potential" if it was one token that could change between them all you only could equip 1 of them anyways. With them being different tokens you could equip 2 of them if they were of different saints as their name would be different (at least until we have a ruling stating otherwise).

If your power is to be versatile it needs to be much more akin to the power level of the Eldest Dragon Orb, in which you get +2 to a given stat. If your power is specialized it can be the crazy high damage boost it is now. But again, I come from a game balance side of this. I understand you see this as missing out on something from having to choose, where I see it as the large patron collectors have the chance to make something great for themselves. It's like you've been crafting your own powerful magical artifact for years and it'll be something you specifically value.

I'm in agreement with this line of thought - I'm much more concerned with the game balance than being able to access all the different "modes" and I will be crafting the token. My plan had been to take the +4 saves power to be universally useful regardless of what class that I play. Now that there is an ear expander option that is dramatically more powerful than all the other options, I view the other selections as "thematic / fluff" selections and expect nearly all of the selections to be ear expander from a power perspective.

Thanks everyone for the great feedback on the Saint Powers. Let's modify the plan ever so slightly so that troublesome St. Wilton's Saint Power moves to a less powerful slot. See below in BOLD.

. ==SAINT POWERS == .

St. Bullo - +3 to hit with Melee attacks
St. Fleck - +3 to hit with Ranged attacks
St. Fokee - +5 to Ranged damage
St. Gubb - May use Eldritch Runestone effect (1/game)
St. Hopp - +5 to Melee damage
St. Lorca - Automatically make all skill checks
St. Raya - +3 to Healing Spells & +3 Sacred damage to damage Spells
St. Stern - +10 to Retribution Damage
St. Valla - +4 to Saves
St. Wilton - May equip up to 2 Head slot items

Jeff Martin wrote: St. Wilton - May equip up to 2 Head slot items

I think this is a very good compromise, and still thematic! Thanks for listening to feedback and all you do for us of the TD Community!

I would have to start slotting stuff to be sure, but two head items still sounds broken to me. If you slot Cranston's in the second slot it gives you an extra eye slot and +2 damage with Ranged. Now you can slot Odin's. So this extra head slot is effectively giving casters +7 Spell damage which is over powered and much better than the other options.

I don't understand why there has to be an option for a slot expander. A slotless item providing a slot expander doesn't make sense compared to all the rest of the choices.

Please reconsider this. I still think a +hp/+AC bonus would be a great option.

I like the new idea for St. Wilton better, but have to ask how it will stack with Follower Sprite.

Another few examples if you pick this power and slot Cranston's as your 2nd Head:

+2 Ranged damage and +3 Ranged to hit with Goggles of the Deadshot so no one would ever pick St. Fleck

+2 Ranged damage and +5 to Focus with Odin's so no one would ever pick St. Fokee or St. Raya

+2 Ranged damage and +1 Figurine of Power and 15 points damage 1/game. If you slot Figurine of Power Raven no one will need to pick St. Lorca

One other thing to consider, all this extra slot stuff makes things much harder for the coders who do the character creators (app and website).

And if there's ever a transmute path for a powerful Head item (or another powerful Eye item, because of Cranston's) then St. Wilton becomes even more broken.

The question is, why is Cranston’s your second head? In most cases, if you’re not equipping Cranstons, you’re knowingly taking a sub optimal choice - like I do equipping Pern’s

Rob F wrote: Another few examples if you pick this power and slot Cranston's as your 2nd Head:

+2 Ranged damage and +3 Ranged to hit with Goggles of the Deadshot so no one would ever pick St. Fleck

+2 Ranged damage and +5 to Focus with Odin's so no one would ever pick St. Fokee or St. Raya

+2 Ranged damage and +1 Figurine of Power and 15 points damage 1/game. If you slot Figurine of Power Raven no one will need to pick St. Lorca

One other thing to consider, all this extra slot stuff makes things much harder for the coders who do the character creators (app and website).

And if there's ever a transmute path for a powerful Head item (or another powerful Eye item, because of Cranston's) then St. Wilton becomes even more broken.

I do agree with your overall point of does this need to be a slot expander? It can become problematic in power level. I don't think Cranston's is most folks second choice, but another item of similar power could come one day, and that could eventually lead us back to a similar scenario we were today (albeit its likely much more limited in scope). What we have today are very reasonable and balanced options in my opinion.

My feelings are: if it doesn't need to be a slot expander I would rather see the options you brought up earlier over a slot expander.

If TDHQ feels it must be a slot expander, the head is probably the best slot for it, especially since the wording caps it at 2. Which is why I said its a great compromise. Hopefully everyone can be mostly happy with this change

St. Wilton allows you to equip up to two head slots and Follower Sprite wording is "May equip 1 extra head slot item". Does this mean you can equip three head slot items when equipping St. Wilton and Follower Sprite?

Did we get final final finalized confirmation of powers? With orders coming up soon and Gamehole in less than 2 weeks I'm sure people will change some of their PYPs based on their new Saints power. I still vote St. Grunnel as the Saint above all.