TOPIC: Level 10 idea

So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

The extra treasure pull is interesting but I think there is already a push to limit treasure pulls to 30 or 50 per person. I know I’ve heard someone say “no more after the next legendary please” capping us at a theoretical 23 - 30 depending on the next few treasure enhancers.

The idea of being able to say “and everyone gets one more HP” and everyone celebrate in the coaching room seems like a moment worthy of 15 years of true dungeon. And while it won’t happen in pre arranged runs since everyone will know their max, it’ll maybe inspire new folks to track their experiences, and might draw questions on what you’ve seen over the years building comminity.

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

The extra treasure pull is interesting but I think there is already a push to limit treasure pulls to 30 or 50 per person. I know I’ve heard someone say “no more after the next legendary please” capping us at a theoretical 23 - 30 depending on the next few treasure enhancers.

The idea of being able to say “and everyone gets one more HP” and everyone celebrate in the coaching room seems like a moment worthy of 15 years of true dungeon. And while it won’t happen in pre arranged runs since everyone will know their max, it’ll maybe inspire new folks to track their experiences, and might draw questions on what you’ve seen over the years building comminity.

+1 HP, even to the whole party, seems pretty underwhelming to me for a 10th level bonus. I still like the chip idea, I could always back bonus treasure chips (probably more than one), there's already a precedent for it at 6th level, and I like the idea of limited use of prestige classes.

Mike Steele wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

The extra treasure pull is interesting but I think there is already a push to limit treasure pulls to 30 or 50 per person. I know I’ve heard someone say “no more after the next legendary please” capping us at a theoretical 23 - 30 depending on the next few treasure enhancers.

The idea of being able to say “and everyone gets one more HP” and everyone celebrate in the coaching room seems like a moment worthy of 15 years of true dungeon. And while it won’t happen in pre arranged runs since everyone will know their max, it’ll maybe inspire new folks to track their experiences, and might draw questions on what you’ve seen over the years building comminity.

+1 HP, even to the whole party, seems pretty underwhelming to me for a 10th level bonus. I still like the chip idea, I could always back bonus treasure chips (probably more than one), there's already a precedent for it at 6th level, and I like the idea of limited use of prestige classes.

I'm honestly not a huge fan of a party buff as a player perk. Traditionally they have not had in game effects. Besides how do we handle stacking, do a full group of lv 10s get +10hps, how do we verify it in coaching, etc

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

I'm not upset, but I'm opposed.

ROSP classes are granted by equipping of the ROSP token.

I am opposed to granting this effect to people who do not equip the ROSP token.

There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

I'm not upset, but I'm opposed.

ROSP classes are granted by equipping of the ROSP token.

I am opposed to granting this effect to people who do not equip the ROSP token.

There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I personally have played as the ROSP subclass twice. The first time, the coach ran out of some 5th level cards and offered them to anyone in our party who had 5th level and chose a class he was out of. That was incredibly exciting. The second time, I did something nice for an owner of the ROSP and they gave me their voucher (we were in the same run together) which I immediately spent and was again thrilled to use. Every now and then, I look back on those two times and enjoy that I did it and occasionally think it might be fun again, but then I look at the cards on TD and suddenly become apathetic about it. I am perfectly okay with only ever being able to play those subclasses again if I go buy ROSP but in my experience I have never used them while equipped with the ROSP.

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

I'm not upset, but I'm opposed.

ROSP classes are granted by equipping of the ROSP token.

I am opposed to granting this effect to people who do not equip the ROSP token.

There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I personally have played as the ROSP subclass twice. The first time, the coach ran out of some 5th level cards and offered them to anyone in our party who had 5th level and chose a class he was out of. That was incredibly exciting. The second time, I did something nice for an owner of the ROSP and they gave me their voucher (we were in the same run together) which I immediately spent and was again thrilled to use. Every now and then, I look back on those two times and enjoy that I did it and occasionally think it might be fun again, but then I look at the cards on TD and suddenly become apathetic about it. I am perfectly okay with only ever being able to play those subclasses again if I go buy ROSP but in my experience I have never used them while equipped with the ROSP.

Certainly I'm fine with TD using RoSP cards when there is a shortage of other cards.

In the other scenario you mentioned, both the vet/you were technically cheating:

tokendb.com/token/rod-of-seven-parts/

"...The rod is not “soulforged” (like artifacts are) and can be used by anyone the owner chooses, but the person playing the sub-class must equip the rod for that adventure."

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

I'm not upset, but I'm opposed.

ROSP classes are granted by equipping of the ROSP token.

I am opposed to granting this effect to people who do not equip the ROSP token.

There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I personally have played as the ROSP subclass twice. The first time, the coach ran out of some 5th level cards and offered them to anyone in our party who had 5th level and chose a class he was out of. That was incredibly exciting. The second time, I did something nice for an owner of the ROSP and they gave me their voucher (we were in the same run together) which I immediately spent and was again thrilled to use. Every now and then, I look back on those two times and enjoy that I did it and occasionally think it might be fun again, but then I look at the cards on TD and suddenly become apathetic about it. I am perfectly okay with only ever being able to play those subclasses again if I go buy ROSP but in my experience I have never used them while equipped with the ROSP.

Certainly I'm fine with TD using RoSP cards when there is a shortage of other cards.

In the other scenario you mentioned, both the vet/you were technically cheating:

tokendb.com/token/rod-of-seven-parts/

"...The rod is not “soulforged” (like artifacts are) and can be used by anyone the owner chooses, but the person playing the sub-class must equip the rod for that adventure."

I wouldn’t say that. It wasn’t “technically” cheating, just cheating, unless the voucher user had equipped the Rod.

The answer is simple. If you want to create another path to the subclasses, then replace the subclass power on the RoSP because you just essentially made it worthless

Matthew Hayward wrote:
In the other scenario you mentioned, both the vet/you were technically cheating:

tokendb.com/token/rod-of-seven-parts/

"...The rod is not “soulforged” (like artifacts are) and can be used by anyone the owner chooses, but the person playing the sub-class must equip the rod for that adventure."

After hearing some persuasive arguments in another game I play, I do believe cheating is an act that can only be accomplished with intention. Misplaying is when players play incorrectly due to ignorance. I will openly admit after reading that, we apparently misplayed ...unless that entry changed from its previous wording and was added after we used the subclass in the way we did? Maybe we played exactly as it was previously written, since it isn’t printed on the token and I don’t know if any changes were made to that entry.

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

macXdmg wrote: So, I have a theory about subclasses also, that there might be a two sided card coming. Giving access to subclasses to high level players would potentially devalue teeth incredibly.

I like the idea of the +1 hp to the whole party, or a chipped token that grants access to an extra clue, or secret dialogue from a monster. Maybe it could be a dagger so it is swappable in the dungeon (also one less item for dagger runs )

Why would subclass affect teeth? The teeth don’t give access to subclasses, the teeth were never rumored to give access to subclasses. I don’t understand the connection. And the token would be intended to be non-transferable like the Medallion/Badge of Nobility.

Why is it relevant to be a dagger? It could just as easily be slotless and then be even easier to show in dungeon without affecting people’s mainhand slot. I would genuinely be annoyed with a 10th level reward that was a mainhand slot intended for all classes.

He probably meant Rods, not Teeth.

I think Shelly and I have a half-dozen unused vouchers. The subclasses are, IMO, largely underwhelming. I used to use them mostly to get to level 5 while freeing up a slot or two, so we haven’t used them since we got our Boots.

And “subclasses for L10” feels kind of redundant. A lot (not all) of the first players to hit L10s will probably have Rods already, so I’d be all “gee, thanks, now my stack of unused voucher/bookmarks can grow twice as fast.”

I have yet to hear of a person with a Rod who is upset with the idea of more people using the subclasses. As it is, it is hard to find even one person with a rod who routinely uses their annual voucher.

I'm not upset, but I'm opposed.

ROSP classes are granted by equipping of the ROSP token.

I am opposed to granting this effect to people who do not equip the ROSP token.

There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I personally have played as the ROSP subclass twice. The first time, the coach ran out of some 5th level cards and offered them to anyone in our party who had 5th level and chose a class he was out of. That was incredibly exciting. The second time, I did something nice for an owner of the ROSP and they gave me their voucher (we were in the same run together) which I immediately spent and was again thrilled to use. Every now and then, I look back on those two times and enjoy that I did it and occasionally think it might be fun again, but then I look at the cards on TD and suddenly become apathetic about it. I am perfectly okay with only ever being able to play those subclasses again if I go buy ROSP but in my experience I have never used them while equipped with the ROSP.

Certainly I'm fine with TD using RoSP cards when there is a shortage of other cards.

In the other scenario you mentioned, both the vet/you were technically cheating:

tokendb.com/token/rod-of-seven-parts/

"...The rod is not “soulforged” (like artifacts are) and can be used by anyone the owner chooses, but the person playing the sub-class must equip the rod for that adventure."

I wouldn’t say that. It wasn’t “technically” cheating, just cheating, unless the voucher user had equipped the Rod.

The answer is simple. If you want to create another path to the subclasses, then replace the subclass power on the RoSP because you just essentially made it worthless

Does it have worth if, as you recounted from your own experience, the owners do not use the ability?