TOPIC: Artisen Token - Non-Auction - Starting Price.

There really should be an Ultra-Ultra-Rare category, because out of these artisan tokens and some other volunteer tokens, only a few were ever made in the first place.  If the definition of Ultra-Rare is 1per100bags, I think from that perspective, the Artisan tokens are the rarest tokens ever made (with the exception of the 3 wishes tokens) that I know about.  <br /><br />Even though there's no real game worth to them, they are definately gonna be popular.<br /><br />

Why bother with a value for the Artisan tokens?  <br /><br />I can see where it may be fun to try, I am sure...and people will be curious of what people bid and what they trade for...but these are "fluff" tokens afterall.  It would be cool to show bid prices and trade values if any are public knowledge.<br /><br />I like to think of these tokens as "fluff" or promo/reward tokens for those who find them or can afford to outbid, outplay and outlast in the auction arena.  Any value that is stuck on them will purely be speculative - so why not avoid the temptation to stick a value on them?  But that's just what I think...otherwise, I agree with Raven - 1000GP is a nice number.

  yeah, I pretty much agree... whenever you have such a limited supply of anything setting a "value" is pretty much useless, as the real value is whatever somebody is willing to pay for it at that moment... you see this phenomenon with rare paintings, baseball cards, etc... the "value" of the item will be set as 200,000, and then it will be put up for auction and it sells for 1,000,000... so what was the point of assigning a speculative value that is so open to fluctuation? not much. I think the value of any artisan token that comes out of the dungeon is exactly what Henwy mentioned in a different thread (if I remember correctly): "Whatever Smakdown is willing to give you..."

If anyone wants to be the one to set the value, I'd happily to pay you 1000 GP worth of stuff for one of them...  <br /><br />Seriously.  PM if interested.  (Or see Josh Berling in the Tavern - he will know how to find me.)

<br />   yeah, I pretty much agree... whenever you have such a limited supply of anything setting a "value" is pretty much useless, as the real value is whatever somebody is willing to pay for it at that moment... you see this phenomenon with rare paintings, baseball cards, etc... the "value" of the item will be set as 200,000, and then it will be put up for auction and it sells for 1,000,000... so what was the point of assigning a speculative value that is so open to fluctuation? not much. I think the value of any artisan token that comes out of the dungeon is exactly what Henwy mentioned in a different thread (if I remember correctly): "Whatever Smakdown is willing to give you..."<br />

<br /><br />Maybe then what is needed is a range value for these???<br /><br />1000-3000 ???

The main variable that will determine the non-auction selling value (if sold) for artisan tokens will be whether it's a new (token poor) or experienced (well equipped but not "collector" level) person. (I'm assuming collector-level types will keep the item).<br /><br />In scenario A (new player): My guess is that if one of the Uber-traders is around, they may just give the person max equip for that player's preffered class... <br /><br />(example: fighter - full plate, longsword +1, shield , bracers, amulet, cloak, 2 rings, and gauntlets...) <br /><br />Add that up and you're talking 2400 gp in items (the key being no GP/Gems need be traded). Most of the classes will be a fairly similar cost, because even though the armor/weapon won't be as expensive they'll get a scroll (bards/mages = mage armor) or whatnot, so to a new player my best guess is your looking at ~2500.<br /><br />Scenario B: that player is going to tend to have most "max" items already so, you're talking premium consumables, a few "fill in the missing piece" VR's, or UR's (if the trader has 2 of one)... but that's going to be very person specific, so difficult to guess at, but with the newbie's setting a price at (my best guess) of around 2500 in items, I'm assuming scenario B will work out similarly... <br /><br />So that's my best guess, and that incite's worth about what you paid for it...

I thought the initial question was regarding the hypothetical "in good faith" advice to provide a newby coming out the the dungeon with one of these weird tokens with a picture on them.  <br /><br />Does one merely just say, "I can never match what the heavy hitters can offer, come back later when <blank> is available"?<br /><br />Does one say, I am guessing you should try and get at lease XXXX GP worth of stuff for that, but I can't give it to you, come back later when <blank> is available"?<br /><br />Or does one say, "well if you want to sell it right now, I'll give you XXX GP for it"?<br /><br />Since most of you have some ethical conscience (OK, so maybe some don't ), I thought the concern was around setting a fair market minimum, so to speak.<br /><br />Which would then be possible to phrase the comment as, "the Trader's guild has recommended 1000 GP as a fair price for that type of token, I can't pay that much, but I can pay 800 GP, if you want to sell it now.  Or if you wish you can come back later and see if there is someone with more to offer".<br /><br />This in theory would prevent the "I just got shafted" reaction from the newby.  I am assuming trades between the enlightened collector, or even non collector player, would be conducted to the benefit of both.<br /><br />Of course, I might have mistaken the nature of the question, or the perception of altruism amongst collectors toward the ill-informed.<br /><br />Dave

<br /><br />...<br /><br />I thought the initial question was regarding the hypothetical "in good faith" advice to provide a newby coming out the the dungeon with one of these weird tokens with a picture on them.  <br /><br />Which would then be possible to phrase the comment as, "the Trader's guild has recommended 1000 GP as a fair price for that type of token, I can't pay that much, but I can pay 800 GP, if you want to sell it now.  Or if you wish you can come back later and see if there is someone with more to offer".<br /><br />This in theory would prevent the "I just got shafted" reaction from the newby.  I am assuming trades between the enlightened collector, or even non collector player, would be conducted to the benefit of both.<br /><br />...<br /><br />Dave<br />

<br /><br />Good post, Dave.  For the points you posted above, it might be nice for the Traders Guild to set a "fair" price which they refer questions to.<br />

'Fair' is a four-letter word in situations like this. I figure that a fair price will just be whatever people can agree on. Frankly, other than for resale, I'm not even sure I want an artisan token. Collecting a set is probaly going to be a near impossibility and that's what usually drives me to pick up the rare but useless items.

Okay - let me rephrase that.  <br />Instead of "fair" price, how about "Starting Price?"<br />

<br />Why bother with a value for the Artisan tokens?  <br /><br />I can see where it may be fun to try, I am sure...and people will be curious of what people bid and what they trade for...but these are "fluff" tokens afterall.  It would be cool to show bid prices and trade values if any are public knowledge.<br />

<br /><br />Its true.  These are "fluff" tokens but I think people are interested in what they sold at.  The public wants to know. 

That's what I said, so we agree on something!!! *writes this day down in journal*  =D<br /><br />To expand a bit - knowing what the winning bid was or even what the runner up bid was =/= value of the token.  <br /><br />Let's say the rings of three wishes are in the hands of the people that will never ever trade/sell them - how do you value that?  the Ring of Regeneration debate also comes back to my mind...  Sure maybe one sells on eBay from time to time...but they are sentimental tokens of honor...most of the guide value (I'd like to think) is that "Bling" factor.<br /><br />Artisan tokens could fetch the uber rare "Bling" factor value - but I agree with Henwy...it's going to be a near impossibility to collect em all...so that to me really takes away from the value of these chase tokens...and besides...as long as valuable PURPs (with in game functionality and benes) exist many, I think, will be after these as the chase targets instead.<br /><br />Don't get me wrong, the Artisan category would be great to keep around forever, but let's see if they become unique treasures found only in the dungeon going forward...and hopefully the auction (gold sink) idea transforms into something more useful for a bigger majority of players...(case in point...what if +1 weapons were the items up for bid...would we have gone into the megga bidder debate, the proxy bidder debate...etc.)