TOPIC: Monster Trophies at Origins - Can we get an official response before Gen Con?

jedibcg wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Picc wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Dathum wrote: I still don't know what changed the Bead of the Lucky Traveler from needing 4 monster bits from 2016, 2017, and 2018. But somehow it needs 6 monster bits from 2019. I cannot find any rationale for that.

During the discussion for the stats on the beads, if people were told that:

a) 6 monster bits were required for 2019
b) Monster bits were going to be about 10% of the treasure mix

The discussion might have gone in an entirely different direction.

We have known it has been 6 MB since the recipe was released. That is nothing new.

Well people were complaining that bits were to easy to get and the cost of fleece was crashing, be careful what you wish for I guess

Someone wished on a monkey’s paw. This development will crash Fleece even more. I’ve already dumped half the bits I was hoarding. I’ll probably dump more, because the 19s are so hard to get, so might as well give up now.

Was just talking to someone who is also going to dump half of his. That’s two for two, and I’m sure we’re not the only ones.

I could be wrong. But no point in changing the mix now. It’ll just make things worse, and piss off all the people who cashed in their TCs at Origins

Anyone dumping 2016-18 monster bit sets now sure is taking a leap of faith that the treasure mix for other cons will be the same as at Origins.

I can't help but notice that the Relic Recipe Fragment? % plus the monster bit % at Origins is almost exactly what the monster bit percentage was in 2018.

I think it's very plausible that there will be no Relic Recipe Fragments? at Gen Con, GHC, and PAX, and the monster bit ratio will return to 20%.

To be clear - I'm not saying it will happen - I'm just saying I don't see how anyone can be so certain it can't happen so as to begin irreversibly mulching monster bits that would be useful if it did - especially when you just need to wait 7 weeks to find out!

I think you math is off. 2018 bits were 20+ %. Fragments are 3% and monster bits 10% that is 13% not 20%

Indeed. Anyway - no reason to be so certain the GC monster bit mix will be the same as the Origins mix so as to destroy things you might want back.

jedibcg wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Picc wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Dathum wrote: I still don't know what changed the Bead of the Lucky Traveler from needing 4 monster bits from 2016, 2017, and 2018. But somehow it needs 6 monster bits from 2019. I cannot find any rationale for that.

During the discussion for the stats on the beads, if people were told that:

a) 6 monster bits were required for 2019
b) Monster bits were going to be about 10% of the treasure mix

The discussion might have gone in an entirely different direction.

We have known it has been 6 MB since the recipe was released. That is nothing new.

Well people were complaining that bits were to easy to get and the cost of fleece was crashing, be careful what you wish for I guess

Someone wished on a monkey’s paw. This development will crash Fleece even more. I’ve already dumped half the bits I was hoarding. I’ll probably dump more, because the 19s are so hard to get, so might as well give up now.

Was just talking to someone who is also going to dump half of his. That’s two for two, and I’m sure we’re not the only ones.

I could be wrong. But no point in changing the mix now. It’ll just make things worse, and piss off all the people who cashed in their TCs at Origins

Anyone dumping 2016-18 monster bit sets now sure is taking a leap of faith that the treasure mix for other cons will be the same as at Origins.

I can't help but notice that the Relic Recipe Fragment? % plus the monster bit % at Origins is almost exactly what the monster bit percentage was in 2018.

I think it's very plausible that there will be no Relic Recipe Fragments? at Gen Con, GHC, and PAX, and the monster bit ratio will return to 20%.

To be clear - I'm not saying it will happen - I'm just saying I don't see how anyone can be so certain it can't happen so as to begin irreversibly mulching monster bits that would be useful if it did - especially when you just need to wait 7 weeks to find out!

I think you math is off. 2018 bits were 20+ %. Fragments are 3% and monster bits 10% that is 13% not 20%

Even so, its plausible some space in the print run was cleared to make room for the fragments/whatever they turn into by reducing the number of bit printed this year.

Dathum, you should read Jeff's whole post, as referenced by jedibcg, but here's a clip:

Jeff Martin wrote: Please remember I want these Relic/Legendary tokens to be a mini-quest within the game for the player. Except for some rare players, most players won't come "naturally" to all the necessary ingredients. I want them to have to search out, trade, and acquire these items--and feel a sense of accomplishment when they transmute their new awesome token.

The ship has sailed on how many monster trophies we have this year. I'm sorry if that's a bitter pill to swallow, but it is what it is. All I can suggest at this point is to take an active part in the token creation and recipe tweaking for the 2020 print run when that process happens later this year.

Druegar wrote: Dathum, you should read Jeff's whole post, as referenced by jedibcg, but here's a clip:

Jeff Martin wrote: Please remember I want these Relic/Legendary tokens to be a mini-quest within the game for the player. Except for some rare players, most players won't come "naturally" to all the necessary ingredients. I want them to have to search out, trade, and acquire these items--and feel a sense of accomplishment when they transmute their new awesome token.

The ship has sailed on how many monster trophies we have this year. I'm sorry if that's a bitter pill to swallow, but it is what it is. All I can suggest at this point is to take an active part in the token creation and recipe tweaking for the 2020 print run when that process happens later this year.

Speaking on which, any thoughts on when that process might begin this year. It feels like its already been forever since the brainstorming died down.

jedibcg wrote:

Dave wrote: As much as I'd like to know the answers, TD may be better off sticking to what they do every year and let us figure it out. It seems fairly consistent that the MB percentage at Origins was around 10%. If TD admits a mistake was made, I can just hear the outcry from people who will claim they were cheated and want something in return.

I do agree with the sentiments that we'll adapt. I would adapt now to assuming the percentage is 10% and move on. I really don't see TD changing mix percentages between cons. I think it's a bad precedence and has people starting to speculate on which cons they need to attend or if they can't make them all, do they just give up and quit the game? Different people will have different reactions, many of them bad.

I suppose they could just confirm that the percentage is lower this year and leave it at that, but I think we already know that based on evidence from Origins.

We don’t even know that though for sure. It could be the percentage was 15% and we all just got really unlucky. It is possible however improbable. I am not looking for them to fix anything just let us know since previously Jeff said he was not lowering bits till 2020. Again if he changed his mind that is fine, just knowing will help people be able to adapt.

This is a request. They can of course choose to ignore it or not to provide an answer. They should know that it is something every player I talked about bits at Origins was not expecting MB to be as low as 10%. Let me state that again EVERY single player I talked to was not expecting MB to be this low some did better than 10% but still were surprised but what seemed like lower percentage. Some were concerned over this. I am letting TD know there is some player concern (not all players but some). How they decide to address it is for them to choose.

Yup, i was suprised at the ratio. I openned a 50 bag around jedi and others and had what i considered a normal number of bits and complained that the bag was kinda bad. Nothing else of note, just a couple greaves and a minor trade token. Jedi said i had a really good bag.

I am planning to make 7 beads, and it never occurred to me that i might not get the monster bits needed. But with this new distribution, it will be close. I pulled more than 10% at origins, and even with my best friends husband joining us at gencon with full treasure, if i get about 10% i will be right on the edge of getting what i need. I might have to run E3 at origins next year multiple times to get the bits i need...let alone whatever i might want for next year transmutes.

...huh, i guess this is one way to make the old dungeon at origins sell out.

Matthew Hayward wrote: Anyway - no reason to be so certain the GC monster bit mix will be the same as the Origins mix so as to destroy things you might want back.

No reason at all, other than post #26

I don't feel that TD needs to tell us anything regarding the percentage of the treasure mix. For any year. It's treasure, you get what you get. If monster bits are less this year and people aren't getting as many as they wanted then either go on more runs or get creative with some trading. If someone can only transmute 5 Beads vs. 10 then oh well. You can only use one Bead on a run anyway. Enjoy the hunt I say!! Cuz at the end of the day it is what it is.

Rob F wrote: I don't feel that TD needs to tell us anything regarding the percentage of the treasure mix. For any year. It's treasure, you get what you get. If monster bits are less this year and people aren't getting as many as they wanted then either go on more runs or get creative with some trading. If someone can only transmute 5 Beads vs. 10 then oh well. You can only use one Bead on a run anyway. Enjoy the hunt I say!! Cuz at the end of the day it is what it is.

I agree they dont need to tell us the mix.
I think it would have been nice to let us know the mix was changing, so people could be prepared. Much like they did let us know that there would be 6 bits instead of 4.

I do think if Jeff hadnt stated that he wouldn't change the ratio for this year, it would have helped a lot. I think no statement would have been better than saying there wouldn't be a change for this year.

Either way, I am thrilled to play TD, and will continue to do so.

kurtreznor wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Dave wrote: As much as I'd like to know the answers, TD may be better off sticking to what they do every year and let us figure it out. It seems fairly consistent that the MB percentage at Origins was around 10%. If TD admits a mistake was made, I can just hear the outcry from people who will claim they were cheated and want something in return.

I do agree with the sentiments that we'll adapt. I would adapt now to assuming the percentage is 10% and move on. I really don't see TD changing mix percentages between cons. I think it's a bad precedence and has people starting to speculate on which cons they need to attend or if they can't make them all, do they just give up and quit the game? Different people will have different reactions, many of them bad.

I suppose they could just confirm that the percentage is lower this year and leave it at that, but I think we already know that based on evidence from Origins.

We don’t even know that though for sure. It could be the percentage was 15% and we all just got really unlucky. It is possible however improbable. I am not looking for them to fix anything just let us know since previously Jeff said he was not lowering bits till 2020. Again if he changed his mind that is fine, just knowing will help people be able to adapt.

This is a request. They can of course choose to ignore it or not to provide an answer. They should know that it is something every player I talked about bits at Origins was not expecting MB to be as low as 10%. Let me state that again EVERY single player I talked to was not expecting MB to be this low some did better than 10% but still were surprised but what seemed like lower percentage. Some were concerned over this. I am letting TD know there is some player concern (not all players but some). How they decide to address it is for them to choose.

Yup, i was suprised at the ratio. I openned a 50 bag around jedi and others and had what i considered a normal number of bits and complained that the bag was kinda bad. Nothing else of note, just a couple greaves and a minor trade token. Jedi said i had a really good bag.

I am planning to make 7 beads, and it never occurred to me that i might not get the monster bits needed. But with this new distribution, it will be close. I pulled more than 10% at origins, and even with my best friends husband joining us at gencon with full treasure, if i get about 10% i will be right on the edge of getting what i need. I might have to run E3 at origins next year multiple times to get the bits i need...let alone whatever i might want for next year transmutes.

...huh, i guess this is one way to make the old dungeon at origins sell out.

I wouldn't expect E3 to make an appearance at Origins next year. Jeff posted plans to make Origins the start of the season and have all new dungeons make their first appearance there starting next year. So plan to get your 2019 monster bits before next Origins.

Rob F wrote: I don't feel that TD needs to tell us anything regarding the percentage of the treasure mix. For any year. It's treasure, you get what you get. If monster bits are less this year and people aren't getting as many as they wanted then either go on more runs or get creative with some trading. If someone can only transmute 5 Beads vs. 10 then oh well. You can only use one Bead on a run anyway. Enjoy the hunt I say!! Cuz at the end of the day it is what it is.

Except Jeff had stated that the ratio wasn’t changing till next year. Again it is fine if it is changing this just that is not what he had previously said so understanding if it is a mistake or the plan or really bad pulls is important. If some needs more monster bits and wants to trade for them knowing their rarity helps determine their value.

jedibcg wrote:

Rob F wrote: I don't feel that TD needs to tell us anything regarding the percentage of the treasure mix. For any year. It's treasure, you get what you get. If monster bits are less this year and people aren't getting as many as they wanted then either go on more runs or get creative with some trading. If someone can only transmute 5 Beads vs. 10 then oh well. You can only use one Bead on a run anyway. Enjoy the hunt I say!! Cuz at the end of the day it is what it is.

Except Jeff had stated that the ratio wasn’t changing till next year. Again it is fine if it is changing this just that is not what he had previously said so understanding if it is a mistake or the plan or really bad pulls is important. If some needs more monster bits and wants to trade for them knowing their rarity helps determine their value.

The treasure mix was always announced in the past. It was announced for 2019. What was said doesn’t match what we’ve seen. I don’t think JediBCG’s request is unreasonable. And sure, it’s their game so they can change the rules anytime they like, with or without explanation.

But a change this drastic would have been more palatable in year one of the next cycle vs year four of this one.
Based on previous years, and what Jeff had said, I figured 300 pulls would give me plenty of bits to make ten beads. Last year it gave enough to make 15. Even with trading, I think I can make four.

I’m trying to be adult about it, but “oh well” and “let them eat cake” doesn’t really work for me. But I’ve accepted there’s not a damn thing to do about it now

Brad Mortensen wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Rob F wrote: I don't feel that TD needs to tell us anything regarding the percentage of the treasure mix. For any year. It's treasure, you get what you get. If monster bits are less this year and people aren't getting as many as they wanted then either go on more runs or get creative with some trading. If someone can only transmute 5 Beads vs. 10 then oh well. You can only use one Bead on a run anyway. Enjoy the hunt I say!! Cuz at the end of the day it is what it is.

Except Jeff had stated that the ratio wasn’t changing till next year. Again it is fine if it is changing this just that is not what he had previously said so understanding if it is a mistake or the plan or really bad pulls is important. If some needs more monster bits and wants to trade for them knowing their rarity helps determine their value.

The treasure mix was always announced in the past. It was announced for 2019. What was said doesn’t match what we’ve seen. I don’t think JediBCG’s request is unreasonable. And sure, it’s their game so they can change the rules anytime they like, with or without explanation.

But a change this drastic would have been more palatable in year one of the next cycle vs year four of this one.
Based on previous years, and what Jeff had said, I figured 300 pulls would give me plenty of bits to make ten beads. Last year it gave enough to make 15. Even with trading, I think I can make four.

I’m trying to be adult about it, but “oh well” and “let them eat cake” doesn’t really work for me. But I’ve accepted there’s not a damn thing to do about it now

Well I wouldn't call announcing treasure pulls a "rule". Was the exact percentage of the mix announced in the past? I don't remember TD giving exact percentages but my memory sucks so I could be wrong. Plus Jeff did say the monster bit mix wouldn't change and maybe it hasn't? I never keep track of any of my pulls and maybe this pull spreadsheet does not have a large enough sampling size to be statistically significant. But I don't think there's any way to know that unless we know total pulls. Even if the mix is announced someone's pulls still may not hit the average and be on the low side of what they expected. So to me, if anyone is expecting to get a certain number of a certain number of Tokens they'll always have a good chance of being disappointed. And if TD has announced any percentages in the past I think they should stop. Treasure is supposed to be a surprise IMO.