TOPIC: Request about the boss for E3

Endgame wrote: For hardcore, I don't think I agree with this:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have collected a few character specific tokens for the major slots. As long as you're using at least all rares you might survive to the end.

I think its more like:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have thoughtfully planned your build and filled your slots with tokens you can get from booster packs, you might survive to the end.

You can make some really solid builds that are like half uncommons and commons...

Endgame, I don't disagree that you can make some solid builds with un-commons and commons so I will caveat that with "It will be really difficult to survive but it is possible."
How's that?

Bob Chasan wrote:

Endgame wrote: For hardcore, I don't think I agree with this:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have collected a few character specific tokens for the major slots. As long as you're using at least all rares you might survive to the end.

I think its more like:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have thoughtfully planned your build and filled your slots with tokens you can get from booster packs, you might survive to the end.

You can make some really solid builds that are like half uncommons and commons...

Endgame, I don't disagree that you can make some solid builds with un-commons and commons so I will caveat that with "It will be really difficult to survive but it is possible."
How's that?

I can go with that. I've never successfully gotten a group to run hardcore, so my only knowledge comes from reading the modules.

By reading the modules, it seems that builds like these:
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=561&id=248798#342040 (+11 hit / +17 damage Barb)
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=565&id=248765#342202 (29 AC Dwarf Fighter)

Would be able to run hardcore and at least make it to the final room. I guess it depends on your definition of survive - if that includes killing the final monster I think that is a different story.

Endgame wrote: I guess it depends on your definition of survive - if that includes killing the final monster I think that is a different story.

Just as we got videos in the training rooms, it sounds like we need signage in the coaching rooms to help ensure everyone understands some of those points we take for granted or learned because we were taught by others.

Example, a sign indicating that the last room is intended to be the final test for the adventure would help manage expectations.

"True Dungeon is designed to challenge you individually and as a group. Only through wits and teamwork will you reach the end of the dungeon where the final test, and perhaps death, awaits."

Endgame wrote:

Bob Chasan wrote:

Endgame wrote: For hardcore, I don't think I agree with this:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have collected a few character specific tokens for the major slots. As long as you're using at least all rares you might survive to the end.

I think its more like:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have thoughtfully planned your build and filled your slots with tokens you can get from booster packs, you might survive to the end.

You can make some really solid builds that are like half uncommons and commons...

Endgame, I don't disagree that you can make some solid builds with un-commons and commons so I will caveat that with "It will be really difficult to survive but it is possible."
How's that?

I can go with that. I've never successfully gotten a group to run hardcore, so my only knowledge comes from reading the modules.

By reading the modules, it seems that builds like these:
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=561&id=248798#342040 (+11 hit / +17 damage Barb)
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=565&id=248765#342202 (29 AC Dwarf Fighter)

Would be able to run hardcore and at least make it to the final room. I guess it depends on your definition of survive - if that includes killing the final monster I think that is a different story.

This may be one of those things where it looks good on paper but IRL it doesn’t work as well. I think there’s an assumption that the group is going to work cohesively and everyone slides are going to be on target. All the casters are going to know exactly what to do and when. I think without that it falls apart a little bit.

Bob Chasan wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Bob Chasan wrote:

Endgame wrote: For hardcore, I don't think I agree with this:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have collected a few character specific tokens for the major slots. As long as you're using at least all rares you might survive to the end.

I think its more like:

Hardcore = So you have done this before and have thoughtfully planned your build and filled your slots with tokens you can get from booster packs, you might survive to the end.

You can make some really solid builds that are like half uncommons and commons...

Endgame, I don't disagree that you can make some solid builds with un-commons and commons so I will caveat that with "It will be really difficult to survive but it is possible."
How's that?

I can go with that. I've never successfully gotten a group to run hardcore, so my only knowledge comes from reading the modules.

By reading the modules, it seems that builds like these:
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=561&id=248798#342040 (+11 hit / +17 damage Barb)
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=565&id=248765#342202 (29 AC Dwarf Fighter)

Would be able to run hardcore and at least make it to the final room. I guess it depends on your definition of survive - if that includes killing the final monster I think that is a different story.

This may be one of those things where it looks good on paper but IRL it doesn’t work as well. I think there’s an assumption that the group is going to work cohesively and everyone slides are going to be on target. All the casters are going to know exactly what to do and when. I think without that it falls apart a little bit.

I'll agree group coordination will wildly swing the effectiveness of the group. My group has been pretty spot on for sliding and coordinating abilities - we completed Vipers last year on one of the early runs without anyone dying and with a few minutes to spare on the last combat, which I guess was very rare.

When designing for Nightmare and Epic, I would say the module should be planned that there will be excellent coordination within the party. I don't think (but don't know) many groups spontaneously decide on Nightmare or Epic - my guess is these groups are going in with a plan in advance.

6. Since he's a super-genius, he's watched the party fight many times and prepared for many of the tricks - a ring of spell turning rebounding the lesser maze spell or other similar nerf spells, mirror images to negate early critical hits or sneak attacks, etc.

This may or may not be true and makes sense for a villain of this nature, but at the same time the adventurers have already encountered the bad guy before, and should likewise be considered to be prepared for the same tricks. In particular, a way to overcome its psychic effects, especially that psychic blur that made things so incredibly difficult for any damage to be done by the entire party no matter what difficulty was run.

However...

The teeth aren't done for another two years. I think it should be a good fight that allows the players to win but the villain retreats at the last second/"dies", only to come back in two years bigger and meaner when the seventh tooth drops.