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TOPIC: 2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two < NEW BIG NEWS at Post #41

2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #13

Jamie Campbell wrote:

Endgame wrote: Will Ranger's using Ralson's be able to slide the charm, or should they stock up on poly potions now?


+1. Ralson uses polymorph potions. Do they use the charm without spending it. Nice if yes


Yes.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #14

Marc D wrote: I'm genuinely interested in charms as a new path for Polymorph tokens. One small request: Can we reinstate the text that explicitly calls this "polymorph" and clarifies the timing as an Instant Action (or free action or whatever)? I can see the current text leading to confusion about how it interacts with other polymorph tokens, such as the 2022 Charm of the Doppleganger.


I updated the contact sheet link with a change to the token. You might have to refresh your cache, though.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #15

David Zych wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: The UR Charm of Trollform has been downgraded to a Rare and thus placed here. Long story...but basically Potions of Polymorph are no more -- and instead replaced by Charms of Polymorph (with a 1/game limit) this year and moving forward. These are designed for newer players and specifically NOT for Legendary Druids.


I love it! Can we get the word "polymorph" on the token somewhere, to help new players figure out what it is? Maybe a truedungeon.com/polymorph URL?

Also: to me this feels a little bit like deja vu from the one year of chargeless wands that players loved (nearly universally AFAICT) but was then reverted the following year. You're confident that's not going to happen with poly charms?


Yes...I am confident.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #16

Jeff Martin wrote:

Endgame wrote: Will Ranger's using Ralson's be able to slide the charm, or should they stock up on poly potions now?


Charms = Potions of Polymorph so yes...Rangers can use the Charm to slide with Ralson's.

Very cool! Will the charm need to be equipped, or can the ranger just bring it along? Will the charm be turned in when used as an animal companion, or since it's a charm, will the ranger get to keep it?
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #17

Endgame wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote:

Endgame wrote: Will Ranger's using Ralson's be able to slide the charm, or should they stock up on poly potions now?


Charms = Potions of Polymorph so yes...Rangers can use the Charm to slide with Ralson's.

Very cool! Will the charm need to be equipped, or can the ranger just bring it along? Will the charm be turned in when used as an animal companion, or since it's a charm, will the ranger get to keep it?


We will update Ralon's entry at tokendb.com when the dust settles. Let's concentrate on the Rare token images, please. Thanks a bunch!
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #18

Charm of Trollform is missing the DP transmute indicator... or would it be AG since it has a damage wheel?

Given the statement on its interactions with Ralson's (i.e., can be used as if it were a Polymorph potion to summon an animal companion without spending it), can I safely assume it can be used with Iktomi's (i.e., can Polymorph into Troll without equipping or spending it) and Druid subclass Summoner (i.e., can summon a Troll without equipping or spending it)?
Cleric main / Druid secondary
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #19

Charm of Trollform Damage observations. The damage rankings for Poly Potions are, as far as I know:
Potion Sea Troll (2022): 7.25 average damage
Shark (2011): 8 average damage
Cave bear (2012). 8.33 average damage.

Trollform is 9.33 average. The other other potions lasted for 1 room and used a standard action to drink (with multiple ways to make it a FA). This charm uses a slot and seems to be instant to transform.

Is 9.33 average damage appropriate? 9.33 may be fine, or it may be too much depending on any upcoming druid card changes. Maybe 8(ish) damage would be more appropriate for this year?
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #20

David Zych wrote:

Jamie Campbell wrote:

David Zych wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: The UR Charm of Trollform has been downgraded to a Rare and thus placed here. Long story...but basically Potions of Polymorph are no more -- and instead replaced by Charms of Polymorph (with a 1/game limit) this year and moving forward. These are designed for newer players and specifically NOT for Legendary Druids.


I love it! Can we get the word "polymorph" on the token somewhere, to help new players figure out what it is? Maybe a truedungeon.com/polymorph URL?

Also: to me this feels a little bit like deja vu from the one year of chargeless wands that players loved (nearly universally AFAICT) but was then reverted the following year. You're confident that's not going to happen with poly charms?


Wait wands are chargeable again?


From tokendb.com/token/wand-of-thors-fury/

"General Wand Errata: Chargeless wands debuted in 2018. Although we loved seeing more wands being used, we feel that unlimited-use wands are not the ideal path going forward. Starting at Origins 2019, all wands will be consumable, but wands will no longer have a fixed number of charges. When a player wants to use a wand (old or new), they hand the wand token to the DM. Actions permitting, the player may use this wand as much as they desire for the rest of the room. At the end of the room, any wand token used will be collected by the DM."

It would be unfortunate if Charms of Polymorph ended up similarly errata-ed in a year or so.


Exactly. I was so mad when that was changed, it didn’t change the power of Medallion of Mystic Mouth, just how expensive it was to play. I almost quit playing that year over it.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #21

Hi. Completely separate from the discussion of combat viability of Charm of Trollform, I really enjoyed getting polymorph potions and growing a toolbox of things to polymorph into as an Iktomi's-wearing Druid. Potion Polymorph (Shark) is one of my favorites for flavor -- I can give up being optimal for a fight if I can be a shark!

The line "not for legendary druids" is concerning to me. Will Iktomi's druids be able to use this charm, or will we be locked out of future polymorphs if we go this no-potion direction?
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #22

Maybe drop the rare wand back down to not a +1 so that it and the UR are not basically the same token after adding enchanter’s whetstone

The UR still has a slightly better damage wheel and does force instead of poison. But given I can find enchanters whetstone at $40 on Trent’s sight, I just don’t think there is a good reason to use the UR.
If you want to keep the rare as +1 and want to add something to the UR, maybe consider having the UR include focus on its damage as the thing done to trick it up enough to make it better.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #23

Wayne Rhodes wrote: Maybe drop the rare wand back down to not a +1 so that it and the UR are not basically the same token after adding enchanter’s whetstone

The UR still has a slightly better damage wheel and does force instead of poison. But given I can find enchanters whetstone at $40 on Trent’s sight, I just don’t think there is a good reason to use the UR.
If you want to keep the rare as +1 and want to add something to the UR, maybe consider having the UR include focus on its damage as the thing done to trick it up enough to make it better.


I think the solution is to bump the UR up a little... maybe. It is a hard choice. The whetstone turns Rares into URs... it is what it does. I would hate for the whetstone to start turning Rares into Uncommons for folks that don't have it.
Last edit: by OrionW.
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2024 Rare Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #24

Wayne Rhodes wrote: Maybe drop the rare wand back down to not a +1 so that it and the UR are not basically the same token after adding enchanter’s whetstone

The UR still has a slightly better damage wheel and does force instead of poison. But given I can find enchanters whetstone at $40 on Trent’s sight, I just don’t think there is a good reason to use the UR.
If you want to keep the rare as +1 and want to add something to the UR, maybe consider having the UR include focus on its damage as the thing done to trick it up enough to make it better.

Force damage ignores Incorporeal. That is a pretty big bonus for moving up to UR - fighting incorp stuff you can just use your +2 stave.
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