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TOPIC: 2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two

2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #13

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote:

Impy wrote: I would like to suggest perhaps having the expanded crit range of Viv's and Kilgor's stack if we can't add another effect, allowing fighters who have both equipped to have a crit range of 18-20.


+1 to this.
Making a class specific weapon where the ability stacks with the class specific neck is the pervue of the department of redundancy department.


-1 to this. The crit stacking/interaction rule already feels overly complicated and at the expense of fun. Once the door opens to exceptions you will see many folks calling for them every year in gear.
Last edit: by OrionW.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #14

OrionW wrote:

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote:

Impy wrote: I would like to suggest perhaps having the expanded crit range of Viv's and Kilgor's stack if we can't add another effect, allowing fighters who have both equipped to have a crit range of 18-20.


+1 to this.
Making a class specific weapon where the ability stacks with the class specific neck is the pervue of the department of redundancy department.


-1 to this. The crit stacking/interaction rule already feels overly complicated and at the expense of fun. Once the door opens to exceptions you will see many folks calling for them every year in gear.


+1 to the -1. Which I guess is zero so add another -1.

Also, I think it's ok for the crit range to be duplicated on both Tokens. Not every player will have both Legendaries.
"Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our point of view" - Obi Wan Kenobi
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #15

Impy wrote: Transmuted tokens look great! Thank you for taking time to respond to people.

I would like to suggest perhaps having the expanded crit range of Viv's and Kilgor's stack if we can't add another effect, allowing fighters who have both equipped to have a crit range of 18-20

Another possible effect could be a life steal effect similar to that of Drow Blood Mace.


+1
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #16

Fred K wrote:

Impy wrote: Transmuted tokens look great! Thank you for taking time to respond to people.

I would like to suggest perhaps having the expanded crit range of Viv's and Kilgor's stack if we can't add another effect, allowing fighters who have both equipped to have a crit range of 18-20

Another possible effect could be a life steal effect similar to that of Drow Blood Mace.


+1


I think Lifesteal would be great because it would allow the sword to work with tokendb.com/token/medallion-of-keenness/ and it would not add much complexity.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #17

I don't know if making it 18-20 is the answer, but leaving the sword as 19-20 crit is probably going to be a waste for many people who would make it. I still think Sundering would have been a great effect for it, but if that is not possible, some other effect should be applied to it perhaps to replace the expanded crit.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #18

Powerblade3 wrote: I don't know if making it 18-20 is the answer, but leaving the sword as 19-20 crit is probably going to be a waste for many people who would make it. I still think Sundering would have been a great effect for it, but if that is not possible, some other effect should be applied to it perhaps to replace the expanded crit.


Would be cool if it added some DEX. That way it feeds into the Fighter necklace a little bit and also into the proposed bow, which Fighters are now on.
"IMHO we like to solve problems here on the forums that are only perceived problems due to a myopic view." -Bob C
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #19

Crit range of 19-20 is consistent with previous years token development where folks pointed out 18-20 crit range was too powerful and too easy to slide. The 19-20 crit range is what has been the new normal for a while now.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #20

I think keeping a few other classes like barb and paladin on the relic sword at least would make it more desirable

For the legendary, if it is savage maybe a bleeding effect or the new poison effect? This would make it a lot more interesting than the power already available to fighters at legendary level.

Phil
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #21

Phil Norton wrote: I think keeping a few other classes like barb and paladin on the relic sword at least would make it more desirable

For the legendary, if it is savage maybe a bleeding effect or the new poison effect? This would make it a lot more interesting than the power already available to fighters at legendary level.

Phil


Small point of clarification, 19-20 crit range is a power already available to fighter at the rare level, as it comes from the rare fighter class necklace: tokendb.com/token/medallion-of-keenness/

Edit: To be clear, I don't think you were claiming it was only available at the legendary level, I just wanted to point out that there are potentially a lot more fighters out there that already have this effect than just those with a legendary.
Last edit: by Michael.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #22

edwin wrote: Crit range of 19-20 is consistent with previous years token development where folks pointed out 18-20 crit range was too powerful and too easy to slide. The 19-20 crit range is what has been the new normal for a while now.

19-20 is available to fighters as a rare level neck and as an ability on the class legendary. For a general use sword across lots of classes, expanded Crit range makes some sense, for fighters it has very limited appeal.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #23

I'm posting feedback about the proposed 4 year Arcanum Greaves transmute which conveys -3 to all damage in the shin slot.

I don't like the proposed Arcanum greaves for several reasons:

1. It sort of kills the slot:
+ The proposed token is strictly better than any alternatives in that slot, so it's an auto equip
+ Once people have a 4 year, set bonus transmute in that slot they aren't going to want any other things to go there

2. It stomps on the capstone Level 5 Barbarian Damage Reduction ability - every class gets 3x the reduction in an uncontested slot.

3. The Eldritch set focused mainly on: STR/DEX/CON bonuses, elemental damage reduction, damage bonuses and spell healing bonuses, and psychic.

I would like to see the Arcanum set focus on something else. Adding DR as the next element after shirt of the Arcanum's STR/DEX/CON/Focus feels like it's retreading the same ground. Maybe the next Arcanum item should focus on some of INT/WIS/CHA, support abilities, and consumables, or wacky effects.

4. Thematically, Greaves is the least "Arcanum"-ey slot I can think of.

5. Minus 3 damage is better than necessary; -2 damage from all + set bonus is already much better than any alternatives.

6. Since the transmute requires a 2023 year UR, there could be bottlenecking on the number of these made because collectors only have 1 year to budget / get one of the pieces (although the 2023 greaves could be reprinted in 2027 while the transmute window is still open to alleviate this).



Alternative Idea:

a. Start the Arcanum transmute for 2024 in a different slot.

Boots of Defiance look like the best basis to me: maybe the theme of the 2nd Arcanum item could be:
* "Powerful 1/game abilities that bypass normal rules but aren't just bursts of damage or healing".

b. If Greaves of the Stalwart need a boost to be desirable; make their ability -2 from melee or ranged, choose at start (players track their own HP anyway so there's nothing app coders or coaches need to do about the choice).



Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
Last edit: by Matthew Hayward.
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2024 Transmuted Token Images < Part Two 1 year 2 months ago #24

Matthew Hayward wrote: I'm posting feedback about the proposed 4 year Arcanum Greaves transmute which conveys -3 to all damage in the shin slot.

I don't like the proposed Arcanum greaves for several reasons:

1. It sort of kills the slot:
+ The proposed token is strictly better than any alternatives in that slot, so it's an auto equip
+ Once people have a 4 year, set bonus transmute in that slot they aren't going to want any other things to go there

2. It stomps on the capstone Level 5 Barbarian Damage Reduction ability - every class gets 3x the reduction in an uncontested slot.

3. The Eldritch set focused mainly on: STR/DEX/CON bonuses, elemental damage reduction, damage bonuses and spell healing bonuses, and psychic.

I would like to see the Arcanum set focus on something else. Adding DR as the next element after shirt of the Arcanum's STR/DEX/CON/Focus feels like it's retreading the same ground. Maybe the next Arcanum item should focus on some of INT/WIS/CHA, support abilities, and consumables, or wacky effects.

4. Thematically, Greaves is the least "Arcanum"-ey slot I can think of.

5. Minus 3 damage is better than necessary; -2 damage from all + set bonus is already much better than any alternatives.

6. Since the transmute requires a 2023 year UR, there could be bottlenecking on the number of these made because collectors only have 1 year to budget / get one of the pieces (although the 2023 greaves could be reprinted in 2027 while the transmute window is still open to alleviate this).



Alternative Idea:

a. Start the Arcanum transmute for 2024 in a different slot.

Boots of Defiance look like the best basis to me: maybe the theme of the 2nd Arcanum item could be:
* "Powerful 1/game abilities that bypass normal rules but aren't just bursts of damage or healing".

b. If Greaves of the Stalwart need a boost to be desirable; make their ability -2 from melee or ranged, choose at start (players track their own HP anyway so there's nothing app coders or coaches need to do about the choice).



Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.


I understand few of your points but the current greaves already off -2 dmg for 6 different types. We know by Druegar that even the arcanum won’t reduce Eldritch dmg. The point of increasing it by 1 point is to make it worth it. Otherwise beyond a set bonus, the current greaves of absorption which work for all types, ranged, melee, and missile. why would I buy 3 more and a bunch of trade goods.
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