TOPIC: Treasure Inflation

macxdmg wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

sarielv wrote: > When I loan them out whatever people get is theirs. It doesn't feel comfortable otherwise - just a shady feel to it.

On the other side of that, I was a little disgusted when a whale benefactor came up to me at the end of a run with his palm out and I had to inform him I had a full set of boosters of my own, so I didn't need his largesse.

The end of the run part of that is a bit confusing. Wouldn't you have told the Coach that you had your own TE tokens when the person was trying to loan them out to the group in the coaching room?

If the gentleman was looking for anything more than a handshake and there wasn't an agreement ahead of time, that is pretty presumptuous.

I agree. I don't have a problem with the person loaning the TE's to get a share of the treasure chips, but only if it's agreed to ahead of time very clearly, with no type of pressure or strong-arming.

It has always seemed to me like it was taking advantage of TD a bit for someone to get a set of 10 TE tokens and then jump into pick up group after pick up group to share their TE tokens with everyone and take a portion of everyone's treasure chips in each run. I'd actually like to see more restrictions on loaning TE tokens, like each one can't be used by more than one person per convention, or even just no more than one person per day. But, that approach was discussed, and I think there was just no way to track the TE token usage or enforce it.

Mike Steele wrote:

macxdmg wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

sarielv wrote: > When I loan them out whatever people get is theirs. It doesn't feel comfortable otherwise - just a shady feel to it.

On the other side of that, I was a little disgusted when a whale benefactor came up to me at the end of a run with his palm out and I had to inform him I had a full set of boosters of my own, so I didn't need his largesse.

The end of the run part of that is a bit confusing. Wouldn't you have told the Coach that you had your own TE tokens when the person was trying to loan them out to the group in the coaching room?

If the gentleman was looking for anything more than a handshake and there wasn't an agreement ahead of time, that is pretty presumptuous.

I agree. I don't have a problem with the person loaning the TE's to get a share of the treasure chips, but only if it's agreed to ahead of time very clearly, with no type of pressure or strong-arming.

It has always seemed to me like it was taking advantage of TD a bit for someone to get a set of 10 TE tokens and then jump into pick up group after pick up group to share their TE tokens with everyone and take a portion of everyone's treasure chips in each run. I'd actually like to see more restrictions on loaning TE tokens, like each one can't be used by more than one person per convention, or even just no more than one person per day. But, that approach was discussed, and I think there was just no way to track the TE token usage or enforce it.

The way to do that would be to rfid all TEs (rares and URs included), then give a unique voucher for each day for that specific rfid. That seems incredibly tedious and will really mess up packs.

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

macxdmg wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

sarielv wrote: > When I loan them out whatever people get is theirs. It doesn't feel comfortable otherwise - just a shady feel to it.

On the other side of that, I was a little disgusted when a whale benefactor came up to me at the end of a run with his palm out and I had to inform him I had a full set of boosters of my own, so I didn't need his largesse.

The end of the run part of that is a bit confusing. Wouldn't you have told the Coach that you had your own TE tokens when the person was trying to loan them out to the group in the coaching room?

If the gentleman was looking for anything more than a handshake and there wasn't an agreement ahead of time, that is pretty presumptuous.

I agree. I don't have a problem with the person loaning the TE's to get a share of the treasure chips, but only if it's agreed to ahead of time very clearly, with no type of pressure or strong-arming.

It has always seemed to me like it was taking advantage of TD a bit for someone to get a set of 10 TE tokens and then jump into pick up group after pick up group to share their TE tokens with everyone and take a portion of everyone's treasure chips in each run. I'd actually like to see more restrictions on loaning TE tokens, like each one can't be used by more than one person per convention, or even just no more than one person per day. But, that approach was discussed, and I think there was just no way to track the TE token usage or enforce it.

The way to do that would be to rfid all TEs (rares and URs included), then give a unique voucher for each day for that specific rfid. That seems incredibly tedious and will really mess up packs.

I don't think Rares would be necessary. Even if the rule were just CoA, which already has the chips, would help. Eventually maybe it could all be done electronically, matching the RFID to someone's badge for the convention or day.

Mike Steele wrote: It has always seemed to me like it was taking advantage of TD a bit for someone to get a set of 10 TE tokens and then jump into pick up group after pick up group to share their TE tokens with everyone and take a portion of everyone's treasure chips in each run. I'd actually like to see more restrictions on loaning TE tokens, like each one can't be used by more than one person per convention, or even just no more than one person per day. But, that approach was discussed, and I think there was just no way to track the TE token usage or enforce it.

You wouldn't just need to map TE's you would need to map them to particular people. Since there is no integration between ticket holder and TD at GC this seems very problematic to me. Possible but problematic. Cons where TD controls the tickets through td.events it would be easier to tie a ticketholder to a TE that has a RFID. That said if most don't see it as an issue, and Jeff doesn't, I don't know why any solution is necessary.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote:

Mike Steele wrote: It has always seemed to me like it was taking advantage of TD a bit for someone to get a set of 10 TE tokens and then jump into pick up group after pick up group to share their TE tokens with everyone and take a portion of everyone's treasure chips in each run. I'd actually like to see more restrictions on loaning TE tokens, like each one can't be used by more than one person per convention, or even just no more than one person per day. But, that approach was discussed, and I think there was just no way to track the TE token usage or enforce it.

You wouldn't just need to map TE's you would need to map them to particular people. Since there is no integration between ticket holder and TD at GC this seems very problematic to me. Possible but problematic. Cons where TD controls the tickets through td.events it would be easier to tie a ticketholder to a TE that has a RFID. That said if most don't see it as an issue, and Jeff doesn't, I don't know why any solution is necessary.

I totally agree, of course, that if Jeff doesn't see it as a problem then no solution is required.

Lequinian wrote: Yikes... The new (old) flame war starts up...

Your TEs so you do what you want and make whatever agreements you want. But...

I can tell you as a new player, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth when a vet vultures over a brand-spanking new player to get an extra 10+ treasure pulls. Saw it. If it'd been me I'd have felt like a piece of meat rather than a valued teammate and probably would have been done (or less invested) in TD.

YMMV.

I don't think ANY token loaning should feel forced or predatory. I have no issue with people offering full TEs and splitting treasure. I had someone loan me two COAs when we were running with 2 new friends and I made sure he got treasure pulls back, even though he didn't even ask. Our friends were, of course, told up front and agreed, though they were pleasantly surprised by the "take care of each other" aspect of it. As a newbie with no/few TEs, I would gladly let vets farm full treasure off me and anything they give is nice...from the other side, now that we 2 loaner COAs and full nuggies, I try to make sure anyone that we loan to gets lots of extras. Everyone gets nuggies with no questions or requirements...whoever wants to take us up on the COAs can have a few extra pulls and kick some back to us...100% optional on that and any loaner gear. I joke about convincing people to use my bard kit in each run, but I'm always ready to play bard myself if no one wants to.

I should add, I'm also super likely to (and have, on more than one occasion) given away gear I drew from the treasure box to people we ran with...particularly if they're new and seemed to enjoy themselves

TLDR: I'll offer people tokens, but never coerce or force them on them and I'm pretty decent at reading a room....I try to be on the "giving" end of the equation and I will do what I can to enhance new player experience.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote: Community has been good to me over the years so I have no issue loaning my TE's at "no cost" these days on PUG runs I join. Now I will and have worked out various deals with folks before runs, attempting to make sure all parties involved are happy. I just don't like the idea of 'cornering' someone in the coaching room. I also don't want anyone ever to feel pressure to use a CoA or CoGF because I will get 1 or 2 less chips if they don't. It is 1 or 2 chips it is not going to make or break me. I would rather we all have a good time.

I've seen this in action (in epilogue) and have never seen predatory activity from you.

Dragon6483 wrote:
I've seen this in action (in epilogue) and have never seen predatory activity from you.

Thank you though I think it would be difficult to tell if may activities were predatory or not. When I run with my group all tokens do end up in my bag at some point. Anyone unaware that it is my group may think I am taking tokens from people....and rightly so because I am. But they are my group so they know tokens are coming back to me to build better characters.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote:

Dragon6483 wrote:
I've seen this in action (in epilogue) and have never seen predatory activity from you.

Thank you though I think it would be difficult to tell if may activities were predatory or not. When I run with my group all tokens do end up in my bag at some point. Anyone unaware that it is my group my think I am taking tokens from people....and rightly so because I am. But they are my group so they know tokens are coming back to me to build better characters.

I'm just saying I saw you come through epilogue many times and I never saw you with any "gimme tokens" attitude I did see people hand you chips, but it was with a smile and a "thank you for your generosity" type of attitude, which is what I hope to see any time.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote:

ralykam wrote: Offering to split is fine, if I saw someone cornering a player and trying to force the matter that would be something entirely different and definitely not a thing I would be okay with. I really hope that isn't happening, I would definitely say something to both parties if I ever saw it.

Even offering a split could be cornering someone. Even if it is advantageous to them. Walking into the coaching room and saying I will give you extra treasure if you give me some of it can put someone into an odd position. I am NOT saying that it always does or even usually does, but it can. I am also NOT saying that people should not do it. I don't care if you think it is fine or not. It is between the people in that coaching room, unless Jeff says something about it. I personally am not a fan of it it happening.

Agreed.

When I loan my extra (and I only have 1 extra set of TEs), I don't want anything out of it. Others can do what they want.

Jeff321 wrote:
Agreed.

When I loan my extra (and I only have 1 extra set of TEs), I don't want anything out of it. Others can do what they want.

My rule is that I should, overall, give more than I get, our our nuggies and stacks of newbie give away tokens hopefully reinforces <3

I just hope no one gets mad that their deal for treasure gets triumphed by 'better' deal for treasure by someone else. I have cut someone's gained treasure short by offering a better deal (no cost) to players without TE's.

Well you have to put up with me for 2 hours, so there is that cost. The individual persons I guess have to figure out if it was worth it to gain extra treasure...lol.