TOPIC: GC Exclusivity only through 2015?

I wanted to let people know that some of my information was outdated in this manner. Jeff does have a contract with Gen Con, and the entirety of this sort of thing is now covered by that contract, and as I've stated, it's not really anyone else's business what that contract is. So I'll just retract my previous statement, sorry for any confusion.

Is it possible that TD is enough of a draw by itself to have its own convention? I expect Gen Con does increase the potential player pool.

If Gen Con and TD were held in Indy at different times, which would you attend?
Would there be enough volunteers?

YupImJen wrote: Is it possible that TD is enough of a draw by itself to have its own convention? I expect Gen Con does increase the potential player pool.

If Gen Con and TD were held in Indy at different times, which would you attend?
Would there be enough volunteers?

If TD were its own con instead of being at gencon, i would be able to volunteer. And i suspect Stacey would as well. And depending on grandparents babysitting, Cat might also. Luckily, i live in indy, so i just get to attend both events.

marimacc wrote: I wanted to let people know that some of my information was outdated in this manner. Jeff does have a contract with Gen Con, and the entirety of this sort of thing is now covered by that contract, and as I've stated, it's not really anyone else's business what that contract is. So I'll just retract my previous statement, sorry for any confusion.

No worries! I am sorry for all the hassle -- and I know you were just trying to help the discussion. I much appreciate your comment here. Thank you.

YupImJen wrote: Is it possible that TD is enough of a draw by itself to have its own convention? I expect Gen Con does increase the potential player pool.

If Gen Con and TD were held in Indy at different times, which would you attend?
Would there be enough volunteers?

Jen
We tried this in 2009. It was called True Realm. It was a great learning experience. It was a lot of fun and I really enjoyed an extra opportunity to hang out with the TD gang for a weekend. However it also showed us a sad truth, we really need GenCon. I don't remember what the exact attendance but it was a lot less than I expected. We had many runs that were empty. (This was when Raven did her famous solo run). The point that I took away from True Realm was that while TD has an active and involved community, it also needs the folks who are never on the forums and who's only interaction is to show up and buy tickets at GenCon.

I don't have any exact number but would guess that at least 75% of the tickets at GenCon are bought by folks that do not consider themselves part of the TD family. We need these people to pay the bills. The "My one TD run is the high point of GenCon but I would never go to a just TD convention" sort of people keep us going. I think even at WYC we would notice this fact if we didn't have a limit on the number of tickets. If we had 1200 tickets instead of 300 at WYC, I bet we would not sell out.

George

George wrote:

YupImJen wrote: Is it possible that TD is enough of a draw by itself to have its own convention? I expect Gen Con does increase the potential player pool.

If Gen Con and TD were held in Indy at different times, which would you attend?
Would there be enough volunteers?

Jen
We tried this in 2009. It was called True Realm. It was a great learning experience. It was a lot of fun and I really enjoyed an extra opportunity to hang out with the TD gang for a weekend. However it also showed us a sad truth, we really need GenCon. I don't remember what the exact attendance but it was a lot less than I expected. We had many runs that were empty. (This was when Raven did her famous solo run). The point that I took away from True Realm was that while TD has an active and involved community, it also needs the folks who are never on the forums and who's only interaction is to show up and buy tickets at GenCon.

I don't have any exact number but would guess that at least 75% of the tickets at GenCon are bought by folks that do not consider themselves part of the TD family. We need these people to pay the bills. The "My one TD run is the high point of GenCon but I would never go to a just TD convention" sort of people keep us going. I think even at WYC we would notice this fact notice it if we didn't have a limit on the number of tickets. If we had 1200 tickets instead of 300 at WYC, I bet we would not sell out.

George

George, I completely agree with you that True Dungeon will do better in a Convention setting as one event among many than as a dedicated True Dungeon convention, because I think that the vast majority of GENCON Dungeon runs are by people that are just doing one or two runs as part of the overall GENCON experience, and wouldn't be willing to devote the time and money to a convention that was just True Dungeon.

That said, I think a follow-on True Realm type convention could be more successful than the first one was. The way True Realm was structured, there really wasn't much incentive for people to go to it if they were already going to GENCON (which would be nearly everyone I suspect). True Realm didn't have any unique XP, Dungeons, completion tokens, etc from GENCON, so someone could attend GENCON and get pretty much everything that True Realm had except for completion buttons. If there were another True Realm, I'd recommend at the minimum the Dungeons there have unique XP from GENCON Dungeons, unique participation tokens, unique completion buttons, and maybe even some unique tokens (or unique variants of tokens) that you could only buy at True Realm (maybe limited to how many each person could buy). I think that would result in a much higher attendance number.

Thanks!
Mike

Mike Steele wrote:

George wrote:

YupImJen wrote: Is it possible that TD is enough of a draw by itself to have its own convention? I expect Gen Con does increase the potential player pool.

If Gen Con and TD were held in Indy at different times, which would you attend?
Would there be enough volunteers?

Jen
We tried this in 2009. It was called True Realm. It was a great learning experience. It was a lot of fun and I really enjoyed an extra opportunity to hang out with the TD gang for a weekend. However it also showed us a sad truth, we really need GenCon. I don't remember what the exact attendance but it was a lot less than I expected. We had many runs that were empty. (This was when Raven did her famous solo run). The point that I took away from True Realm was that while TD has an active and involved community, it also needs the folks who are never on the forums and who's only interaction is to show up and buy tickets at GenCon.

I don't have any exact number but would guess that at least 75% of the tickets at GenCon are bought by folks that do not consider themselves part of the TD family. We need these people to pay the bills. The "My one TD run is the high point of GenCon but I would never go to a just TD convention" sort of people keep us going. I think even at WYC we would notice this fact notice it if we didn't have a limit on the number of tickets. If we had 1200 tickets instead of 300 at WYC, I bet we would not sell out.

George

George, I completely agree with you that True Dungeon will do better in a Convention setting as one event among many than as a dedicated True Dungeon convention, because I think that the vast majority of GENCON Dungeon runs are by people that are just doing one or two runs as part of the overall GENCON experience, and wouldn't be willing to devote the time and money to a convention that was just True Dungeon.

That said, I think a follow-on True Realm type convention could be more successful than the first one was. The way True Realm was structured, there really wasn't much incentive for people to go to it if they were already going to GENCON (which would be nearly everyone I suspect). True Realm didn't have any unique XP, Dungeons, completion tokens, etc from GENCON, so someone could attend GENCON and get pretty much everything that True Realm had except for completion buttons. If there were another True Realm, I'd recommend at the minimum the Dungeons there have unique XP from GENCON Dungeons, unique participation tokens, unique completion buttons, and maybe even some unique tokens (or unique variants of tokens) that you could only buy at True Realm (maybe limited to how many each person could buy). I think that would result in a much higher attendance number.

Thanks!
Mike

And to dovetail off of Mike's excellent suggestions, place it opposite calendar-wise, six months away from GenCon. Late February would be perfect, right after everyone began receiving their first token pre-orders. I would rather spend my money on a TD-only event than buy an $80 GenCon badge. If it failed before, perhaps after 2015 it could be attempted again on a smaller scale. I'm certain Jeff knows the smallest he could make such an event and still turn a profit. GenCon, Origins, WYC - all started small.

Thanks,

Joshua

February is not a good time. I didn't make True Realm because of weather. February would have that problem from many attendees.

I like the idea of TD happening more than once a year but I agree I don't think its ready for a stand alone event. It must be coupled with another event that is an established draw. My crew love TD but we also love Gencon. As a coach I see more folks come in that have never played or played only once then I see established players. So its likely safe to say that he majority of the attendence is of people not dedicated to TD and might not turn up to a TD only con.

Who knows that might change.

Where I could see TD branching out to, would be at an event like DragonCon. Mega large attendence, would likely sell out a TD event even if its just in a nearby hotel ball room as long as its close enough to the action and people knew about it.

valetutto wrote: I like the idea of TD happening more than once a year but I agree I don't think its ready for a stand alone event. It must be coupled with another event that is an established draw. My crew love TD but we also love Gencon. As a coach I see more folks come in that have never played or played only once then I see established players. So its likely safe to say that he majority of the attendence is of people not dedicated to TD and might not turn up to a TD only con.

Who knows that might change.

Where I could see TD branching out to, would be at an event like DragonCon. Mega large attendence, would likely sell out a TD event even if its just in a nearby hotel ball room as long as its close enough to the action and people knew about it.

i am all for TD branching out, but some of it isn't realistic (at least i don't think). atlanta is a far drive from carbondale..that is a lot of cost to ship the props etc.
if it does branch out, it would see it staying in the midwest..as always I can/could be wrong

I'm not so wild about the next step being another mega convention. Something midsize would be better.

One GenCon style hotel hassle a year is more than enough.

Harlax wrote: I'm not so wild about the next step being another mega convention. Something midsize would be better.

One GenCon style hotel hassle a year is more than enough.

Better for you or better for TD? I don't know just posing the question.