Bob Chasan wrote: So OBVIOUSLY you have given this a lot of thought and energy. Not directed at Incognito but the community as a whole, This thread has devolved into what sounds like a bunch of spoiled children not getting what they want and throwing a temper tantrum. IF you have a solution for the betterment of the ENTIRE community please share it. I'm sure TPTB would be greatly interested.
It's not surprising that players act like a bunch of spoiled children because there are lots of big spenders who are used to getting their way and gamers as a demographic tend to not have the best social skills as well as having a tendency to be stubborn about doing things their preferred way. Factor in that this will be a growing problem as the millennial "it's all about me!" generation gets more active in TD.
As @jedibcg mentioned, there isn't going to be a single solution that will solve all problems. And there will also not be a single solution that makes things better for EVERYONE. And even if there are excellent solutions Bob, you're making a big assumption that TPTB will be "greatly interested" in it. For years and years, there have been concerns about volunteer and DM quality. Many players (with Ed DeVaney taking the lead) have strongly advocated for some sort of feedback/evaluation system so that players can provide direct feedback on the DM's they had. Yet nothing ever gets implemented. Most players are just told to "talk to a Dungeon Coordinator if they have a problem" but a lot of players feel that after doing so, they aren't really being listened to.
So obviously signups are messy and for something with limited runs sign up is the best option. Is there another out there that I am missing????
Imagine the staff required or the online capabilities to allow players to claim their class before the convention.
Does this negatively impact new and casual players?
Do you have a better solution?
That's the entire purpose of this thread. To encourage discussion, generate solutions, and evaluate their feasibility.
There is an established policy and if followed mitigates the problem. If you have a better solution please share it. I coach quite a lot and so will put forth the policy as I understand it. Druegar, please correct me if I am wrong. (Never known to happen but there's always a first time)
The "established policy" has many flaws and isn't even properly executed most of the time.
- It doesn't address the problem of late arrivals trying to use their 3rd level perk. This is a problem that a lot of coaches have complained about.
- The website currently says that in the event of a conflict, *all* players of 3rd level should roll off and take turns choosing. Right now, most coaches simply have the involved players roll off and often they are supposed to take whatever classes are left.
- It doesn't address the problem of how to verify someone is 3rd+ level. Otherwise, everyone can just claim it (and say that they are "smakdown, just look at my XP level!").
- Not to mention that there is a real problem if player coaches are trying to pressure people or shame people into not utilizing the official procedure (which includes the 3rd+ level perk system).
NOT OFFICIAL POLICY - This entire discussion is essentially to mitigate unhappy players which most often happens when new players choose a class a more experienced player has chosen. In my time coaching, I have only Once seen two players not be able to work it out amicably, as adults, with little to no hurt feelings.
To recall an anecdote, the most contentious conflict I ever saw was back in 2014 WYC when two very experienced players both insisted on playing Druid. It got really ugly and messy....
Back to my point, I have heard of players contacting a coach when they had back to back runs to pull a particular class card for a certain run, if they have the correct wristband. (not endorsing simply reporting) What happens when the rest of the PUG shows up? If there isn't a rogue card in the stack of character cards, they don't feel like they are missing something. If it occurred and there were more experienced players who knew about the rogue card and asked specifically for that card, I would guess that the class would belong to them. The facts are: you aren't there to claim it so it goes to someone else.
Back to Official Policy: If you show up on time and no one else is there you are Certainly able to claim a character class, show your stats on the approved app, website, or excel spreadsheet then go do something else until you're supposed to go into the training room.
So if you arrive early and at the official start time, no one else is there, would you say it is okay for you to claim your preferred class and ask the player coach to fill in your stats because everyone else is late and missed their opportunity?
That's not actually official policy because official policy does NOT have a cutoff time, which is one of the things we are discussing/proposing.
TLDR: Be an adult, this is a game. It's not the end of the world if you don't get to play your desired character class once in a while. At Origins, a friend and I joined a group where classes had been chosen. He has played Druid for at least the last 10 years and in the last 6-7 hasn't missed a single skill check. I had additional tokens and the best remaining class available was Ranger. Guess what, he really enjoyed playing Ranger.
Hey Mikey - Try it, You might like it.
Wow, you sound really condescending telling people to "be an adult." The vast majority of TD players ARE adults, and a good number of non-adults playing shouldn't technically be allowed to do so.
Being an adult also means accepting alternative perspectives, viewpoints, and ideologies other than your own. And that means accepting that different people are going to have varying perspectives on what is a sufficient "player friendly attitude" and at what point you need to stop coddling newbies (or veterans or big buyers).