Raven wrote:
Flik wrote: Pretty bummed on the change to the lenses. There are only 11 bows ever printed that the rogue can even use, and the uncommon one coming out in this set and last years common bow are the only ones printed since 2014.
I cannot see anyone actually picking this up. A UR that you’ll have to use an uncommon weapon for just to sneak at range. I can’t see that replacing a UR crossbow that I just picked up last year.
Heya Flik - I was the one who suggested a drawback (only useable with Bows) to offset the complaints folks were making that this token is straight-up power creep, and doesn't force any choices.
I think that - while it's not necessarily anyone's Dream Token - it's a pretty decent way to get the Ranged Sneak ability reprinted, after so many folks were asking for a reprint or near-reprint. I do know a lot of Rogues who use a bow... particularly the +1 Mighty ShortBow, which adds their Str to damage. IF it had presented in this form at the beginning of token development (rather than getting people's hopes up for a Power Creep token) I think folks would have been much more receptive, and happy for the chance to get Ranged Sneak back into their build.
Once thing which I didn't register until Boilerplate pointed it out, was that there's no Rare bow this year. I could have sworn I'd seen a Rare Shortbow early in development... but I guess it got dropped. Even so, the +2 Dex on these Lenses mean an extra +1 to hit... which would be the same as a +1 Rare shortbow being used with the old Lenses of Vital Insight. You'd be out 1 pt of damage on the wheel... but still gain the bonus +1AC and Rfx save from the +2 Dex. Not a bad trade-off!
So, yeah - I still think this is a fine UR, with an effect people have been asking for, and forces choices. It would be better with a Rare Shortbow in the set, but those are still very easy to acquire on the secondary market.
Or, if it's really too restrictive - as many folks suggest - change it to Shortbows *AND* Crossbows.
That still forces choices for the Hammer Rogues... and honestly, that's a good place to present a choice.
Either way - I'm really glad the name changed. Thanks, Jeff!
Raven it’s definitely cool that you provided a solution to the perceived problem.
Honestly even if there was a rare short bow in the set I don’t think that would change anyone’s thoughts.
It’s just not desirable to sneak from ranged $100 with that big of a restriction. There are two many good URs for rogues to pick up at PYPs, especially new Rogues, that this UR would be an extreme low priority picking up.
Consider in-print PYPs a new rogue would want first: Stunning Crossbow, Cloak of Shadowskin, IS Gold Nugget, IS Fire/Banshee Prism, Ring of Heroism/Cook’s Hat, Shoes of the Sneak, Ring of the Yeti/Drake, Flaming Blade, the Arcane Set, Charm of Brooching/Glory. After half of those are picked up now they might look at the lenses.
All these arguably make a much bigger “splash” impact then new players with their bliss shortbow.
Now with the last minute change all the vets don’t want the item. Even third year token collectors like me are disinterested.
I think it was a good idea to restrict the lenses from sneaking with Thor’s at range. Just make it “all bows” on the restriction. Then crossbows would work and I think most people would still pick it up. Or just reprint Vital Insight. Or keep it to previous 5 iterations as +2 dex no restriction.