TOPIC: Time to start the 2021 Token dev process

Wow 2021,
Too far away for me to deal with.

Xavon wrote:

Fred K wrote:

Xavon wrote: Okay, maybe a little early, but I had this idea today, and didn't want to let it get away:

Circlet of Redirection
After all sliding is done, add +1 to you slide result (one puck only), treating your attack as if that was the value you slid (1/room)
Usable by: All

So if you slide a 19, you can bump it to Nat 20. Or on an 'odds miss monster', change that 17 to an 18.

Compare to Crown of Might, which is melee only, but is +1 to hit and damage on all attacks, and part of the Might set.

Yours is good but I wouldn’t let it include creating crits - with x3 damage items out there, it probably becomes too powerful.

If you don't allow criticals, there's no real point in using this over Crown of Might. I wanted it to be a tactical choice, A constant but slight boost to hit and damage, versus the ability to upgrade to a 20 if you hit 19. Well, I suppose if you had other 'trigger on 20' items. Or again, had the 'miss on odd' monster.

I say stop putting "All" on so many tokens. This feels in line with the Fighter abilities (Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization). Limit it to Fighters-only and then maybe even bump the power up to change the slid value by up to 2. Give Fighters an alternate choice besides armor in the head slot. Or leave it at 1, allow Barbarians and Paladins also, and make it the first step of the Fighter transmute.

But before we talk 2021 tokens, can we please tackle Int/Wis and the character card updates first?!?!

I was too late with my Underthing & Tomb of Terrors ideas because I didn't know it was happening until the set was mostly complete! This can't happen again. (But then again, not knowing what's coming next, you can't theme anything.)

So, other ideas:

A caster weapon (Rod) that can be used for melee, ranged (possibly at a flat 4 damage or something), and slid Spells. (this would be a great first try at a 2-sided token, or you could have a damage circle that's not numerically linear (so that you could specially mark 1-4 as the "spell boost" damage.

Bard Weapon Ideas:

Maybe a triangle of Feeding - ring it and eaten items give a bonus HP?

Or ring it and everyone can eat as a free action

Bagpipes of Drowning/Cacophony - give no bonus (beyond the natural 1/1 or 2/2) but prevent ALL spellcasting?
Tambourine - one-handed instrument (no bonuses) that can be used with a shield or weapon?

Also, I was thinking of having a One-Man-Band token or set. A torso or back slot token that allows for performing while leaving your hands free, or a bigger set of tokens:

Back: Drum: Allows for performance (no bonus) if the Bard can move
Pants or Shins: Cymbals: +1 hit or +1 dmg bonus if the Bard can move
Hands: Either allow for any instrument, or a specific one, or a Shield that is a drum or cymbal, and a weapon that is a drumstick or hammer
Neck: Harmonica stand: Allows for performance (no bonus) hands-free

And then some kinda set bonus

So like 4-5 rare slots ends up like a top-tier instrument, but either you need Free Movement to get the set's full effect, or if you're using the harmonica, you can't do spells or scrolls, if you're using the set instrument, you don't have your hands for better weapon/shield combo (Footman set, etc).

We should be able to come up with better wording for the rod of the meek by next year.

My current suggestion, please pick it apart:

Cannot crit. Melee damage modifier becomes 0.

Yes, this means if you have 6str, you still get a 0 damage modifier (bonus). If you have 18 str, you lose damage.

Endgame wrote: We should be able to come up with better wording for the rod of the meek by next year.

My current suggestion, please pick it apart:

Cannot crit. Melee damage modifier becomes 0.

Yes, this means if you have 6str, you still get a 0 damage modifier (bonus). If you have 18 str, you lose damage.

Interesting. Though no class currently has a STR below 11, so the bonus side would not come in to play.

I still think:
When slid, max +7 to hit and +7 to damage.

Is the simplest for players and coaches. It is a bit of trouble for DMs, but really no more than the the previous versions.

But I was also thinking:
May not be used with level increasers

So forget about the bonuses, just don't let it be used by 5th (or whatever the higher level happens to be) characters.

The level idea is interesting.

Could have a drawback if fifth level or a bonus if fourth level. The latter might be more popular but doesn't work very well if fourth level ceases to exist in the future.

STR 8 or less is easily accomplished, I do it all of the time.

I don't see why Rod of the Meek is so difficult as there are plenty of ways to encourage meekness. So many of the ideas that were proposed become ridiculous when you do a side by side comparison against other UR weapons, such as the Flaming Blade. I'll take -1 to hit and no drawbacks over the crazy nerfing that the Rod kept getting.

What is the intent with the token? To just be different? Probably not, as want people to actually want to buy them. Can work backwards from a theoretical build to figure out how it should work.

Xavon wrote:

Endgame wrote: We should be able to come up with better wording for the rod of the meek by next year.

My current suggestion, please pick it apart:

Cannot crit. Melee damage modifier becomes 0.

Yes, this means if you have 6str, you still get a 0 damage modifier (bonus). If you have 18 str, you lose damage.

Interesting. Though no class currently has a STR below 11, so the bonus side would not come in to play.

I still think:
When slid, max +7 to hit and +7 to damage.

Is the simplest for players and coaches. It is a bit of trouble for DMs, but really no more than the the previous versions.

But I was also thinking:
May not be used with level increasers

So forget about the bonuses, just don't let it be used by 5th (or whatever the higher level happens to be) characters.

Don't forget tokens that give a strength penalty like the vicious charm - its quite easy to drive str down to 6.

If you set a Max modifier it is slightly more difficult to manage than just baking it into the wheel. Instead of allowing +7 damage, just add extra damage to the wheel. No need to modify +hit.

Endgame wrote:

Xavon wrote:

Endgame wrote: We should be able to come up with better wording for the rod of the meek by next year.

My current suggestion, please pick it apart:

Cannot crit. Melee damage modifier becomes 0.

Yes, this means if you have 6str, you still get a 0 damage modifier (bonus). If you have 18 str, you lose damage.

Interesting. Though no class currently has a STR below 11, so the bonus side would not come in to play.

I still think:
When slid, max +7 to hit and +7 to damage.

Is the simplest for players and coaches. It is a bit of trouble for DMs, but really no more than the the previous versions.

But I was also thinking:
May not be used with level increasers

So forget about the bonuses, just don't let it be used by 5th (or whatever the higher level happens to be) characters.

Don't forget tokens that give a strength penalty like the vicious charm - its quite easy to drive str down to 6.

If you set a Max modifier it is slightly more difficult to manage than just baking it into the wheel. Instead of allowing +7 damage, just add extra damage to the wheel. No need to modify +hit.

I think you are misunderstanding my intent.

The idea is not that you just get +7. That is the max you get, when you use this weapon. You could have +10 to hit and +20 to damage on the party card. But when you switch to the +3 Rod of the Meek, it effectively become +7/+7. Switch back to your +1 club (for example) and you would get the full +10/+20.

If you only had +3/+4, then it wouldn't change, and you would still get that.

The idea being for a new/green or even a low red player, this would be a good weapon, giving her a boost. Say she had +3/+5 with a (+1) rare weapon. She can use this as her primary/listed weapon and get +5/+5 with a better damage wheel.

IF you are a purple/BiS player, you probably aren't going to want to use because you already have +8/+8 or better. But it might be nice to have as a backup against a monster that needs a +3 or better weapon to damage. In that case you could use it, but the bonuses are scaled down.

MetaphoricDragon wrote: Do we know, are the fighters getting a joint legendary, or is fighter and dwarf fighter getting split?

There could be 4 different next year: fighter, dwarf fighter, wizard, and elf wizard.

I'm not really sure how I want there to be differences in the wizard and elf wizard. Maybe if the token has two printed powers on that would apply to each might do.

kurtreznor wrote:

MetaphoricDragon wrote: Do we know, are the fighters getting a joint legendary, or is fighter and dwarf fighter getting split?

There could be 4 different next year: fighter, dwarf fighter, wizard, and elf wizard.

5 if clerics get one....

Makes me think that there will only be three with no differences in the wizards or fighters.