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TOPIC: The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux

The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #229

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.


Raven, consider your beer held, well done! :laugh:

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #230

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.


You forgot the rage quit threat. And posting terrible things on Facebook, Reddit and the GenCon forums. ;)
D&D teaches all the important lessons in life - the low blow, the cheap shot, the back stab, the double cross. - Jerry Marsischky

Let them trap us. We have our swords. - Elric of Melnibone.

You try to get them to play the game, but all they want to do is play the rules. - Ardak Kumerian

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend - Faramir

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #231

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Harlax wrote:

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.


You forgot the rage quit threat. And posting terrible things on Facebook, Reddit and the GenCon forums. ;)


Pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, Also could it somehow let my druid throw Thors hammer while polymorphed, Jeff did say

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Lets argue about what he meant with that ! B)
Semper Gumby, Always flexible.

Sartre sits in in a coffee shop and asks for a coffee without cream. The barista apologizes “Sorry, we don't have any cream. Can I offer you a coffee without milk instead?”

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Last edit: by Picc.

The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #232

Picc wrote:

Harlax wrote:

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.


You forgot the rage quit threat. And posting terrible things on Facebook, Reddit and the GenCon forums. ;)


Pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, Also could it somehow let my druid throw Thors hammer while polymorphed, Jeff did say

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Lets argue about what he meant with that ! B)


I believe he may have omitted "away" at the end of that. :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:
D&D teaches all the important lessons in life - the low blow, the cheap shot, the back stab, the double cross. - Jerry Marsischky

Let them trap us. We have our swords. - Elric of Melnibone.

You try to get them to play the game, but all they want to do is play the rules. - Ardak Kumerian

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend - Faramir

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #233

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Harlax wrote:

Picc wrote:

Harlax wrote:

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.


You forgot the rage quit threat. And posting terrible things on Facebook, Reddit and the GenCon forums. ;)


Pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, pedantic nitpick, Also could it somehow let my druid throw Thors hammer while polymorphed, Jeff did say

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Lets argue about what he meant with that ! B)


I believe he may have omitted "away" at the end of that. :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:

We cant assume that, please find the oldest possible post where Jeff ever said "away" :whistle:
Semper Gumby, Always flexible.

Sartre sits in in a coffee shop and asks for a coffee without cream. The barista apologizes “Sorry, we don't have any cream. Can I offer you a coffee without milk instead?”

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Last edit: by Picc.

The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #234

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Last edit: by edwin.

The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #235

Raven wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: This thread needs more Druid debate!

Go! :dry:


Hold my beer: I got this!

NO WAY this token should go to print in its current form! A Druid with access to this has a potential 990 POINTS of damage over 10 rounds of combat! And if they Polymorph after doing all that damage, they could TURN INTO A LICH!
Seriously, has no one but me considered the CONSEQUENCES a token like this could have on the longevity of True Dungeon as a game? Can no one see the POWER CREEP?!?!? LICHES WILL STEAL YOUR CoA's!!

After I've invested eleventy-billion dollars* in my token collection, I am absolutely incensed that my tokens could be devalued by a party member turning into a Lich, because they will steal ALL my URTEs and without a solid cap on treasure pulls, the entire TD economy will collapse. I'm not just thinking about this for my own self interest, either. If Jeff loses the faith of the token-buying community, I'm afraid TD will never financially recover. Jeff and his family will be living in a van down by the river!

The only way this token should be printed is if we:

A) Have it grant +1 Level to anyone with a "B" in their last name,
B ) Have it provide at LEAST 3 Charm slot expanders, and 5 more Iouns,
C) +4 CON to keep in competitive with proposed Elfstone Shared (or, just move +4 Con to the Shard, thanks)
D) Make it a Wildcard part of ANY set
and while we're at it, I think we should adjust the graphics to include more Sapphires!

Don't hate on me: I'm just trying to consider game balance here!


*Canadian. So, with conversion to US, about $250 total.

:laugh:

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #236

edwin wrote: Posting #42
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&defaultmenu=141&catid=615&id=250035&start=36#347657

Posting #2
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&defaultmenu=141&catid=615&id=250586&start=0#356932

. So the speculation by even Druegar himself was exactly what I said and what I imagine the rest of the community thought too.

Jeff did. later say once in a design post and nowhere else that wasn’t the case, effectively acknowledging the token text as printed was not unambiguous (implying they same of the tdb entry). Good to know.
I play Wizard.

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #237

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

edwin wrote: Posting #42
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&defaultmenu=141&catid=615&id=250035&start=36#347657

Posting #2
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&defaultmenu=141&catid=615&id=250586&start=0#356932

. So the speculation by even Druegar himself was exactly what I said and what I imagine the rest of the community thought too.

Jeff did. later say once in a design post and nowhere else that wasn’t the case, effectively acknowledging the token text as printed was not unambiguous (implying they same of the tdb entry). Good to know.


Clearly no longer 7 teeth for hit points with semi-lich skull from the first post.

Name and functional similar to RoSP is speculation.

First posting of this thread layed that speculation to rest. Similar to RoSP so one can not equip Skull of Cavadar along with any individual teeth.

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #238

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Anthony Barnstable wrote: So the speculation by even Druegar himself was exactly what I said and what I imagine the rest of the community thought too.

Jeff did. later say once in a design post and nowhere else that wasn’t the case, effectively acknowledging the token text as printed was not unambiguous (implying they same of the tdb entry). Good to know.

I might be misunderstanding what you are saying but Jeff's post is before Druegar's post. Maybe I am misunderstanding and that you are not saying the order incorrectly and if so I apologize. Not making point about validity of anything else just making sure that we both understand the timing of the statements.
You either discover a star or you don't. You arrogant punk.

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #239

jedibcg wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote: So the speculation by even Druegar himself was exactly what I said and what I imagine the rest of the community thought too.

Jeff did. later say once in a design post and nowhere else that wasn’t the case, effectively acknowledging the token text as printed was not unambiguous (implying they same of the tdb entry). Good to know.

I might be misunderstanding what you are saying but Jeff's post is before Druegar's post. Maybe I am misunderstanding and that you are not saying the order incorrectly and if so I apologize. Not making point about validity of anything else just making sure that we both understand the timing of the statements.


I’ll be honest, I have no idea how to find time stamps on posts. I assumed Druegar reads app design threads and posts, and all posts by Jeff, so the tdb is always accurate. Based on that assumption, I would have imagined it would be impossible for Druegar to speculate something would happen if Jeff had already said it explicitly wouldn’t at that time. That was how I created my timeline of those two posts.

If they were posted in the other order, wouldn’t that imply a behind the scenes conversation happened for Druegar to speculate Jeff’s post was not a “final answer” and this speculation was more likely to become the truth?

Really, either order points to a clear understanding the token was not unambiguous as printed, the tdb was not unambiguous (given the post by Druegar on how he speculated the *Grill would be worded), and nothing was done to acknowledge this outside of that one design thread, which is probably something we can all agree created confusion that never needed to exist?

Maybe we can accept that confusion happened, there is no fixing that it already happened now. There is no pretending it never should have happened.
I play Wizard.

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The Skull of Cavadar: Part Deux 1 year 9 months ago #240

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote: So the speculation by even Druegar himself was exactly what I said and what I imagine the rest of the community thought too.

Jeff did. later say once in a design post and nowhere else that wasn’t the case, effectively acknowledging the token text as printed was not unambiguous (implying they same of the tdb entry). Good to know.

I might be misunderstanding what you are saying but Jeff's post is before Druegar's post. Maybe I am misunderstanding and that you are not saying the order incorrectly and if so I apologize. Not making point about validity of anything else just making sure that we both understand the timing of the statements.


I’ll be honest, I have no idea how to find time stamps on posts. I assumed Druegar reads app design threads and posts, and all posts by Jeff, so the tdb is always accurate. Based on that assumption, I would have imagined it would be impossible for Druegar to speculate something would happen if Jeff had already said it explicitly wouldn’t at that time. That was how I created my timeline of those two posts.

If they were posted in the other order, wouldn’t that imply a behind the scenes conversation happened for Druegar to speculate Jeff’s post was not a “final answer” and this speculation was more likely to become the truth?

Really, either order points to a clear understanding the token was not unambiguous as printed, the tdb was not unambiguous (given the post by Druegar on how he speculated the *Grill would be worded), and nothing was done to acknowledge this outside of that one design thread, which is probably something we can all agree created confusion that never needed to exist?

Maybe we can accept that confusion happened, there is no fixing that it already happened now. There is no pretending it never should have happened.


I thought we mostly agreed to that a page or two back? I think we got distracted when Jeff told us we needed more Dr. Uid hating in this thread.

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