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Mike Steele
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10th Level
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Supporter
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Posts: 20166
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Fred K wrote: Mike Steele wrote: Kirk Bauer wrote: I really like the costs of the safeholds themselves. I think it is very solid. You can spend a total of $200, $600, $1200, $2000, or $3000 to get to each level. I think that's great.
As I think about it, I think the Follower is a tad too expensive, and perhaps should be just a bit lower like $500. I think Mythic I is too expensive and should be closer to $1,500. Remember, you spend $3,000 to be able to craft a Mythic I, so I think $2,000/ea on top of that is a bit steep.
Aren't you basically then pricing each Mythic I at about the cost of a Legendary (which I believe average about $1,500 to transmute)? Breaking the $3000 Stronghold cost down by the 10 Mythic tokens you can make just adds $300 each to them. That seems way too low to me. It seems like the starting point of a Mythic Recipe should be a Legendary token, and then add TG and GP on top of that.
Remember that market value of the most expensive legendary is $1,500 right now. The most expensive eldritch is RoSP at around $4,000. Mythic 1 is more than twice the most expensive put of print eldritch item. For perspective, for $10K, you can buy every eldritch that has been made plys a CoA and have enough left over for 5 runs at GenCon.
In value selling courses, we teach that one of the ways to see if you found the sweet spot in pricing is if your target customers vocally complain, but end of buying.
In that metric, assuming his target audience are the bigger collectors who get at least 1 $8K order just for themselves each year, Jeff nailed the pricing.
Personally, I’m in that group. The transmute costs are very high for the value presented but still at the edge of being reasonable. My question is will it be worth it to wait and just buy one off the resale market at half the cost versus building myself.
One problem with this high transmute cost is I can’t see doing more than 1 at all - as in zero chance probability of doing it. That’s not a good precedent for collectors trying to get 1 of everything as once we realize 4 tokens will be out of reach, it makes the effort to collect others less important as well. That probably only applies to 10 or 15 of us, though.
I’d recommend lower pricing for making the 2nd+ copy but that begs the problem of the resale market canibalizing new transmutes. That could be prevented by making them soul-bound, though.
I appreciate how the lower levels are accessible for newer players to get, at least, something in this hierarchy.
I think you're comparing apples and oranges. Comparing the transmuting cost of a Mythic vs the secondary market cost of a Legendary isn't an accurate comparison. We need to be comparing the transmuting cost of a Mythic vs the transmuting cost of a Legendary. The Mythic tokens are significantly more powerful than Legendary tokens, and they should cost significantly more to transmute as well. Personally I think it is a big mistake to aim the Mythic transmuting cost at $1,500, which has been stated earlier is around the transmuting cost of a Legendary. My recommendation is the Mythic recipe include a Legendary token and then at least another $1,500-$2,000 in ingredients at Mythic II and $3,000-$4,000 at Mythic I.
I also think it's not accurate to state that the cost of a Safehold I is part of a single Mythic token price. Safeholds V, IV, and III all have VERY valuable bonuses. Between Safehold II and I you can make 10 Mythic tokens. That means, if it costs $3,000 to buy the Safeholds, that only adds $300 per Mythic token - and that's ignoring all the benefits from Safehold V-III.
So, if we aim the transmuting cost for a Mythic at $1,500, even adding in that $300 price means we're only slightly higher than a Legendary transmuting cost ($1,800 vs. $1,500), which again I think is far too low.
For those that are going to transmute fewer than 5 Mythic tokens, there would probably be a market for the remaining transmutation tokens, for players that have Safehold II or I and want to transmute more than the 5 Mythics that come with each of those levels.
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